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Inspired by over-the-cubical-wall conversations about the changing world of electronics and electrical engineering, Daniel Bogdanoff and Mike Hoffman created an electrical engineering podcast. Covering a broad range of topics from the basics of electrical engineering to the tough engineering problems of tomorrow’s technologies, Daniel & Mike bring in members of Keysight’s engineering team to provide their unique perspectives.
- 61 - Measurement Overkill and why “Accuracy” is the Wrong Word – #42
Metrology Podcast May 20th is a special day - World Metrology Day! Get a bit of history and learn about all things metrology when you join Daniel Bogdanoff, Bob Stern, and Chris Cox in this special Metrology Day electrical engineering podcast! App note mentioned by Bob: https://bit.ly/DecisionRules More about Keysight metrology, calibration, and services: https://www.keysight.com/find/metrology Topics and time tags: 0:00 World metrology day, and a brief history of the meter and the ohm 2:00 Keysight University has FREE test gear courses! 2:45 Bob Stern, Keysight Metrologist Chris Cox, Keysight Regional Metrologist 4:30 Why does metrology matter? How does it impact us? The global economy relies on a consistency of measurement and test, which is why metrology is important. It allows measurements made in one country to be used and replicated in other countries. 7:25 Metrology and measurement traceability is important. An unbroken chain of traceability is one of the key components of metrology and calibration. It's a bit like a game of telephone leading back to SI units. 10:00 Keysight DMMs get calibrated off the first commercially available Josephson Junction - a tool that uses quantum physics to provide a very stable voltage. 11:16 Accuracy vs. Measurement Uncertainty A production engineer might say "accuracy" but really it's all about "measurement uncertainty" Vocabulary of international metrology (VIM): https://www.bipm.org/en/publications/guides/vim.html 12:15 A practical example of how different instruments have different levels of uncertainty 13:45 What's the significance of measurement uncertainty for a user of test gear or a production engineer? 15:33 The internal adjustments that the factory makes to an instrument are some of the most closely guarded intellectual property / trade secrets. 18:15 The Army uses mobile Josephson junctions to test the DMMs used in Apache helicopter field testing. 18:45 Metrology overkills - times when people went overboard with their measurement uncertainty 21:10 How do you quantify measurement uncertainty? There's "test uncertainty ratio" which uses your expanded measurement uncertainty. 23:00 You can also get to percent risk, which is easy to wrap your head around. Bob Stern and Chris Cox authored some papers on this topic. 24:00 Why do people make measurements in the first place? There are no perfect measurements 26:45 Metrology in the government/military vs. private sector 29:00 There are a lot of factors for metrology equipment calibration and the engineering metrology equipment. There are different "levels" of calibration and different depth of reporting
Wed, 20 May 2020 - 33min - 60 - Life Lessons from electroBOOM! – DON’T PLAY WITH HIGH VOLTAGE! (Mehdi Sadaghdar Interview) – #41
That time Mehdi almost died on camera, science & tech on YouTube, 50 takes of the same scene, and more life advice from Mehdi Sadaghdar, aka electroBOOM! Join Mehdi and Daniel Bogdanoff in an random park in downtown New York City in this electrical engineering podcast episode. Mehdi is awesome check him out at: https://www.youtube.com/electroboom Episode sponsored by the 5G track, everything you need to know about 5G everything: https://www.keysight.com/find/LEARN5G Video: Audio: Approximate time tags: 1:00 He gives away tools to people that actually need it 1:30 electroBOOM is bringing electronics and electrical engineering to the mainstream Science channels are really growing on YouTube 2:55 How much does Mehdi prepare for his videos? 3:30 Most of Mehdi's mistakes and explosions are planned and scripted 4:30 The comment section is always interesting 5:10 Mehdi has a Master's Degree in Electrical Engineering 6:00 He doesn't have a very good pain tolerance 6:40 He has a hard time keeping a straight face when something's coming in the video 7:00 Jacob's Ladder project - he almost died and learned that he should not be a mechanical engineer "I would be dead if it wasn't for my flimsy wiring…" 8:40 Before he became a full time YouTuber he worked doing electronics for a boating steering and control company 9:50 Mehdi got his undergrad degree in Iran, Master's in Canada 10:00 How Mehdi got into electronics - one of his relatives got him an electronics kit as a kid and he loved it 10:40 electroBOOM is not as good of a channel name as his daughter's channel, electroCUTE 11:40 Mehdi works really hard on his videos Most underrated joke: "I don't have a very long term memory" 12:25 Mehdi's wife didn't used to like his videos, she thought they were boring. But, she's since come around 13:30 He watches PewDiePie and lots of science channels 14:40 Mehdi and "Mr. Tripod" do all his production work 16:20 The content is what matters, it's not about the production value 17:10 Every paragraph that he reads, he tries it 10 - 50 times so that it comes out straight. Usually it's just the last take that he keeps 17:40 Is it "recording" or "taping"? Can you still say "taping?" 18:10 Batteries can explode in beautiful ways 18:45 what other good science channels do you recommend? Cody's Lab, Smarter Every Day, Veratisium, The Sci Show 19:20 Follow Mehditation on YouTube as well: https://www.youtube.com/mehditation 19:35 If you really want to learn electronics, you must experiment. Just pickup some random project, start building, and you will learn. And if you don't care about electronics, do something else. I don't know… …but don't play with high voltage!
- 21min - 59 - Little Big Power: Femtoamps and Regenerative Supplies – #40
When power systems get ridiculous... Power goes way beyond basic bench power supplies. Daniel Bogdanoff sits down with Chris Cain to explore femtoamp measurements, 100 kV multi-quadrant regenerative power systems, noise, and space-borne solar arrays in this EEs Talk Tech electrical engineering podcast! Audio: Learn more about the Keysight RP7900 regenerative power systems (RPS) and the Keysight CX3300 Dynamic Current Analyzers 0:17 Recording from New Jersey with Chris Cain, who manages teams for electronic industrial products, like power, DMMs, function generators, DAQs, board test, etc. 1:15 Current analyzer behind us measures FEMTOAMPERES of current. This is useful for RF and IoT systems. 4:20 Chris’s most spectacular equipment failure – a new engineer put their electrolytics in backwards 6:30 For extra large electrolytic capacitors people design vent holes in PCB 8:15 High power power supplies. 5kW and 10 kW power supplies 9:00 Two quadrant power supplies vs. one quadrant power supplies 10:30 A 100 kV power supply!? What’s that used for? Battery emulation for things like electric cars. The supply has to be able to both source and sink power, and switch between the two very quickly 12:15 A regenerative power supply (RPS) rectifies input voltage and puts it back on the AC mains instead of dissipating it as heat like a normal electronic load. So, the overall cooling requirements are very different for an RPS than a normal electronic load. One of the big costs for industrial factories is air conditioning and heat management. So, a regenerative power supply is very useful because it reduces heat. 15:15 Regenerative power supplies are also useful for testing photovoltaic inverters, for both terrestrial and space solar systems. 18:45 Noise parameters for high power systems 20:30 Power is very complex, and the systems are very dynamic 22:15 Giant toroidal transformers are used for power supplies and are dynamically controlled. They also are leveraged from systems like source measure units (SMUs). 24:30 Precision current measurement is very different than measurement, it often uses a triax 25:30 Some systems have 5 or 6 wire measurements to help with guardbanding
- 28min - 58 - 5G, Beamforming, & MIMO – #39
5G means business. With wired speeds coming in over the air, designers are turning to new wireless techniques like beamforming, MIMO, and advanced tower synchonization designed to pump you full of bits. Find out more as Daniel Bogdanoff sits down with Brig Asay and Joe Haver to discuss the changing wireless ecosystem of tomorrow. Audio: Video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XX0r22fSBwI 1:00 4G was sub 6 GHz, but 5G is much higher frequencies (24 GHz, 28 GHz, 39 GHz, and above 50 GHz) 2:15 4G test strategies: simple source and a middle-of-the-line signal analyzer. There were also some combo boxes that were both signal sources and signal analyzers. 4:00 5G testing requires more powerful setups. There are still generators, but they have to be more powerful. FR2, 100 MHz, 200 MHz, 400 MHz wide bands make things more complicated. Chambers and OTA (over the air) testing and MIMO systems make things much more complicated. And, a 5G system has to cover all of these ranges. 5:30 MIMO for 5G - MIMO means "Multiple Input Multiple Output" Beamforming is also being implemented. Designers need to be able to test and see all the 5G signals at once. 7:00 Beamforming explanation and discussion - essentially beams can be directed with constructive and destructive interference to send signals to UEs (user equipment). 5G beamforming significantly increases the power delivered to a UE. Want to try it? Try "Build a beam" here: https://www.keysight.com/main/editorial.jspx?cc=US&lc=eng&ckey=2800374 10:00 5G brings wired-level speeds to wireless systems, which will open up brand new markets that haven't even been defined yet. 11:15 5G security 12:00 Are 5G bandwidths a challenge? A wider carrier channel means more interference and a lower effective number of bits / SNR (signal to noise ratio). So, the wide 5G bands require a more robust design. This is especially true for distance. Even windows are potentially a challenge with 5G frequencies, so beamforming becomes critical. 15:30 Testing 5G with a signal analyzer / spectrum analyzer - is it doable? Sorta... How do you look at four distinct bands at one time? 18:00 The UXR oscilloscope can actually look at multiple bands at once at 0.5 EVM (error vector magnitude). 20:00 Why does 5G have so many different frequencies and bands? Isn't that excessive? 21:00 Will 5G make it where I can get rid of my home internet provider? 22:00 Beamforming from a cell tower is pretty easy, but it's much harder for a handset. So, there are systems that propose 5G downlinks, but 4G or 3G back up to the tower. 23:00 Multiple towers can talk to the same handset AT THE SAME TIME! Multiple towers can provide the same packet at the same time to the same UE to increase the power. This means they are all working on the same clock as well. 25:00 There are a number of ways to synchronize multiple cell towers at the same time. GPS is common, but there are a number of other feasible technologies. 27:00 Brig has to get in his "vicious Keysight plug" for the mmWave extension on the UXR that lets an oscilloscope behave like a signal analyzer. It also uses a 1mm connector on the front end. 31:45 Stupid question: if you had to describe 5G using five words that start with "G" what would they be?
- 34min - 57 - USB4 – No more Mr. Nice Guy, your USB-C connector has to do it all! – #38
New tunneling modes, the scoop on plugfests, and 40 Gbps! Get the FREE! Tech Tip eBook about testing 6 emerging technolgy standards: http://bit.ly/PodcastTechTrends Subscribe on YouTube ► http://bit.ly/KeysPodcastSub ◄ It feels like USB 3.2 just came out, but USB4 is HERE! With USB4, gone are the days of wondering what's behind that USB Type-C connector - all the functionality is mandatory. And, you get double the speed! 40 Gbps over two 20 Gpbs lines keeps Moore's law happy (which makes us happy). Find out more in today's podcast with Jit Lim, Mike Hoffman, and Daniel Bogdanoff. Video version: Twitter: @DanielBogdanoff: https://twitter.com/DanielBogdanoff Subscribe with your podcast tool: iTunes: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/ees-talk-tech-an-electrical-engineering-podcast/id1238385165 Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/4j9CG7Z1iy9zkjnOSVHB6f Google: https://podcasts.google.com/?feed=aHR0cHM6Ly9lZXN0YWxrdGVjaC5jb20vZmVlZC9wb2RjYXN0&hl=en Stitcher: https://www.stitcher.com/podcast/keysight-technologies/ees-talk-tech RSS: https://eestalktech.com/feed/podcast/ees-talk-tech Notes & Topics: 1:45 The USB-IF released the USB4 Spec in September USB4 requires that you use the USB Type C connector USB4 is fully backwards compatible USB4 uses a 20 Gbps x2 link (pronounced "by two") so Moore’s law still holds (yay!) USB 3.2 took 10 Gbps and doubled it to 20 Gbps It’s USB4 not USB 4.0 and not USB 4 (confirmed) 10:00 With USB4 you must implement USB-PD (USB Power Delivery), but in the past it was optional. USB4 brings a doubling bitrates, you must use Type C connector, and must be backwards compatible all the way to USB2 13:30 USB 3 and USB 3.2 had a lot of alternate modes, but USB4 implements a tunneling mode. With tunneling allows you to send packets of USB, DisplayPort, or PCIe inside of the USB protocol. This means you don’t have to run it as an alternate mode, which requires extra silicon. 17:00 The silicon is often prototyped before a spec is actually released, so that the spec can match reality and be possible to build. 18:30 USB4 is already being prototyped and tested. At the USB workshop-plugfest USB plugfests are very secret, and company names aren’t used. They use a “test ID number” instead of company name, and the attendance is very limited. In many cases, only Keysight and the company testing their device are allowed to be in the room while the testing is done. 21:00 A “Compliance Test Spec” describes how you test a device against a specification. Because, you can’t test for every single thing in the spec, but you can test a subset of things to verify performance. 22:00 Will USB take over everything? It depends on the other organizations and specifications groups. There are other ecosystems and organizations like VESA (DisplayPort) and HDMI that are autonomous. But, both HDMI and VESA have a USB Type-C mode that allows the protocols to work over a USB Type C connector 26:00 USB4 implementation is very complex! The different speeds that could be used are pretty complex. USB4 is advertised 40 Gbps, but it’s actually 20 Gbps x2. 30:15 It can be 5 Gbps, 10 Gbps, 20 Gbps, and run at x1 or x2, and it can also do alt modes. 31:55 Are there any main competitors to USB4? What about the lightning connector from Apple? 35:30 There’s evidence that there will be a USB4 native display, and some high end USB4 monitors already exist. 36:30 USB4 is coming, and if you want to be on the leading edge you better get started now (and why)! 38:20 - stupid questions: When will see USB5? What’s the lamest way someone could use USB4? If USB4 is truly universal, shouldn’t it go into space? Helpful Links: Keysight Bench Facebook page: https://www.facebook.com/keysightbench Keysight RF Facebook page: https://www.facebook.com/keysightrf EEs Talk Tech Electrical Engineering podcast: https://www.eestalktech.com https://www.youtube.com
Thu, 21 Nov 2019 - 41min - 56 - Teaser: EEs Talk Tech Season 2!
It ain't over. We're back with a hot new season, premiering November 21, 2019! Audio: Video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TYlmB1OUQck iTunes: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/ees-talk-tech-an-electrical-engineering-podcast/id1238385165 Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/4j9CG7Z1iy9zkjnOSVHB6f Stitcher: https://www.stitcher.com/podcast/keysight-technologies/ees-talk-tech Google Play and Google Podcasts: https://podcasts.google.com/?feed=aHR0cHM6Ly9lZXN0YWxrdGVjaC5jb20vZmVlZC9wb2RjYXN0&hl=en
- 1min - 55 - IC Packaging – #37
The unsung heroes of the IC world - packaging engineers! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VQeBgRy8fJk The pictures I promised: The UXR Amplifier Fanout Package: Bert Signal Conditioning Hybrid Packaging: UXR Data Processor Flip Chip Packaging:
- 33min - 54 - Space Technology – #36
Space requires new technologies. Much like the space race of the 1950s, engineers are feverishly working to gain a competitive advantage. Mark Lombardi sits down to explore rad hardening, thermal vacuum chambers, space mining, CubeSats, and battery technology. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CTi_LMNZ708 Mark Lombardi - 25 years at HP/Agilent/Keysight. He worked for RT logic for a few years, where he got into space. 2:00 - Your odds of survival getting to space are better than getting to the top of Everest. 2:30 - Space mining from the Asteroid belt has the potential to create the worlds first trillionaire. 3:20 - We need to establish manufacturing in space. For example, what if you manufactured satellites on the moon instead of on earth? 4:00 - The main driver is price-per-pound 6:10 - The Space Force - it sounds a little silly at first but is very reasonable when you take a closer look. 7:45 - How do you test objects bound for space? 8:30 - Space is transitioning from government-only to commercial. Businesses are starting to explore how to add value to society and make a profit from space. 9:15 - Phased arrays, reusable rockets, LEO satellites are all changing space technology. 10:00 - Low earth orbit satellites have much lower delay. Geosynchronous satellites have a 250 ms propagation delay. This has interesting implications for 5G - that 250 ms latency is too long for 5G requirements. So, LEO satellites are what will be used. 12:00 - Using LEO satellites will be deployed in force instead of as singles, as mentioned in the Weather Cubesat podcast. 13:45 - Ghana launched their own satellite, which is a huge step. They eventually won't be dependent on others for their space access. And, they can do specialized things for reasonable prices. 15:00 - Announcements - we haven't podcasted in a long time, sorry! We are switching to 1x per month 16:45 - Radiation hardening for electronics, sometimes called electronics hardening. Historically, you had to plan for a long life in a satellite. Now, you don't have to. 17:30 - It's also hard to get a rad hardened cutting-edge technology. 18:00 - LEO satellites get less radiation, so it's less of a problem. And, since they are cheaper, you can build in an expected mortality rate. 19:00 - You can also rev hardware faster, allowing you to use newer technology. Think about imagers, the technology has moved a long way in seven years. 19:55 - Space is cold. Space is a vacuum. So, to test our gear you have to reproduce that on earth. To do that, we use special chambers. 20:50 - Thermal vacuum chambers (T vac) are used to test space objects. Automotive parts are actually very resilient to temperature changes and can be leveraged into space designs. 21:30 - What happens to electronics in space? The vacuum is a bigger challenge than the temperature changes. 23:30 - To get more bandwidth, we have to increase frequency. This leads to attenuation in the air and in cables. Some designers are switching to waveguides. 25:00 - With modular test equipment, you could potentially have test gear that can survive in space. 27:00 - What is the current and projected size of the space industry? 28:10 - What batteries are used in space? What factors into battery decisions? - Lithium ion batteries work well in space, and are used when we can charge them with solar energy. 28:40 - Deep space exploration uses all sorts of obscure battery technology. 29:10 - Electronic propulsion 30:05 - Over 150V, things get interesting. The breakdown voltage is different in space than it is on earth. So, designers have to be very careful.
- 32min - 53 - New 110 GHz Oscilloscope – UXR Q&A #35
Brig Asay, Melissa, and Daniel Bogdanoff sit down to answer the internet's questions about the new 110 GHz UXR oscilloscope. How long did it take? What did it cost? Find out! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_GxotFVQ8HE Some of the questions & comments S K on YouTube: How long does it take to engineer something like this? With custom ASICs all over the place and what not… Glitch on YouTube: Can you make a budget version of it for $99? Steve Sousa on YouTube: But how do you test the test instrument?? It's already so massively difficult to make this, how can you measure and qualify it's gain, linearity etc? TechNiqueBeatz on YouTube: About halfway through the video now.. what would the practical application(s) of an oscilloscope like this be? Alberto Vaudagna on YouTube: Do you know what happen to the data after the dsp? It go to the CPU motherboard and processed by the CPU or the data is overlayed on the screen and the gui is runner's by the CPU? How does a piece of equipment like that get delivered? I just don't think UPS or Fedex is going to cut it for million+ dollar prototype. It would be nice to see some higher magnification views of the front end. Ulrich Frank:mNice sturdy-looking handles at the side of the instrument - to hold on to and keep you steady when you hear the price... SAI Peregrinus: That price! It costs less than half the price of a condo in Brooklyn, NY! (Search on Zillow, sort by price high to low. Pg 20 has a few for $2.7M, several of which are 1 bedroom...) RoGeorgeRoGeorge: Wow, speechless! R Bhalakiya: THIS IS ALL VOODOO MAGIC Maic Salazar Diagnostics: This is majestic!! Sean Bosse: Holy poop. Bet it was hard keeping this quiet until the release. jonka1: Looking at the front end it looks as if the clock signal paths are of different lengths. How is phase dealt with? Is it in this module or later in software? cims: The Bugatti Veyron of scopes with a price to match, lol One scope to rule them all...wow! Keyesight drops the proverbial mic with this one Mike Oliver: That is a truly beautiful piece of equipment. It is more of a piece of art work than any other equipment I have ever seen. Gyro on EEVBlog: It's certainly a step change in just how bad a bad day at the office could really get! TiN: I have another question, regarding the input. Are there any scopes that have waveguide input port, instead of very pricey precision 1.0mm/etc connectors? Or in this target scope field, that's not important as much, since owner would connect the input cable and never disconnect? Don't see those to last many cable swaps in field, even 2.4mm is quite fragile. User on EEVBlog: According to the specs, It looks like the 2 channel version he looked at "only" requires 1370 VA and can run off 120V. The 4 channel version only works off 200-240V The really interesting question: how do they calibrate that calibration probe. They have to characterize the imperfections in it's output to a significantly better accuracy than this scope can measure. Unless there's something new under the sun in calibration methodology? Mikes Electric Stuff @mikelectricstuf: Can I get it in beige? Yaghiyah @yaghiyah: Does it support Zone Triggering? User on Twitter: It’ll be a couple paychecks before I’m in the market, but I’d really be interested in some detail on the probes and signal acquisition techniques. Are folks just dropping a coax connector on the PCB as a test point? The test setup alone has to be a science in itself. I’d also be interested in knowing if the visiting aliens that you guys mugged to get this scope design are alive and being well cared for. Hi Daniel, just out of curiosity and within any limits of NDAs, can you go into how the design process goes for one of these bleeding-edge instruments? Mostly curious how much of the physical design, like the channels in the hybrid, are designed by a human versus designed parametrically and synthe
Fri, 21 Sep 2018 - 44min - 52 - One Protocol to Rule Them All!? – #34
USB Type-C brings a lot of protocols into one physical connector, but is there room for one protocol to handle all our IO needs? Mike Hoffman and Daniel Bogdanoff sit down with high speed digital communications expert Jit Lim to find out. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YYGXPbCfEHg 0:00 This is Jit's 3rd podcast of the series 1:00 We already have one connector to rule them all with USB Type-C, but it's just a connector. Will we ever have one specification to rule them all? 2:00 Prior to USB Type-C, each protocol required it's own connector. With USB TYpe-C, you can run multiple protocols over the same physical connector 3:00 This would make everything more simple for engineers, they would only need to test and characterize one technology. 3:30 Jit proposes a "Type-C I/O" 4:00 Thunderbolt already allows displayport to tunnel through it 4:30 Thunderbolt already has a combination of capabilities. It has a display mode - you can buy a Thunderbolt display. This means you can run data and display using the same technology 6:30 There's a notion of a muxed signals 7:00 The PHY speed is the most important. Thunderbolt is running 20 Gb/s 7:15 What would the physical connection look like? Will the existing USB Type-C interface work? Currently we already see 80 Gb/s ports (4 lanes) in existing consumer PCs 9:20 Daniel hates charging his phone without fast charging 9:40 The USB protocol is for data transfer, but is there going to be a future USB dispaly protocol? There are already some audio and video modes in current USB, like a PC headset 11:30 Why are we changing? The vision is to plug it in and have it "just work" 12:00 Today, standards groups are quite separate. They each have their own ecosystems that they are comfortable in. So, this is a big challenge for getting to a single spec 13:15 Performance capabilities, like cable loss, is also a concern and challenge 14:00 For a tech like this were to exist, will the groups have to merge? Or, will someone just come out with a spec that obsoletes all of the others? 15:30 Everyone has a cable hoard. Daniel's is a drawer, Mike's is a shoebox 16:30 You still have to be aware of the USB Type-C cables that you buy. There's room for improvement 17:30 Mike wants a world of only USB Type-C connectors and 3.5mm headphone jacks 18:30 From a test and measurement perspective, it's very attractive to have a single protocol. You'd only have to test at one rate, one time 19:30 Stupid questions
- 20min - 51 - The Huge Challenge of Testing USB 3.2 – #33
USB 3.2 testing is darn hard! We talk compliance test specs, USB 3.2 testing BKMs, and pre-spec silicon. Guest Jit Lim sits down with Mike Hoffman and Daniel Bogdanoff to talk about the new difficulties engineers are facing as they develop USB 3.2 silicon. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JYfiWTG-Nic Agenda: In the last electrical engineering podcast, we talked about how USB 3.2 runs in x2 mode ("by two") This means there's a lot of crosstalk. The USB Type C connector is great, but its small size and fast edges means crosstalk is a serious concern. When we test USB, we want to emulate real-world communications. This means you have to check, connect, and capture signals from four lanes. For testing Thunderbolt you always have to do this, too. Early silicon creators and early adopters are already creating IP and chips for a spec that isn't released yet. 2:00 They're testing based on the BKM (Best Known Method) 3:30 Jit was just at Keysight World Japan, where many people presented BKMs for current technologies. Waiting for a test spec to be released is not an excuse for starting to work on a technology. 4:50 How many companies are actually developing USB 3.2 products? The answer isn't straightforward - the ecosystem is very complex and there are multiple vendors for a single system (like a cable). 6:30 Many USB silicon vendors will develop an end-product and get it certified to prove that their silicon will work. They then sell the silicon and IP to other companies for use in their products. 7:50 Daniel listened to an interesting podcast about how Monoprice reverse engineers complex products and sells them for cheaper: https://www.npr.org/sections/money/2014/11/28/366793693/episode-586-how-stuff-gets-cheaper 9:40 There are some BNC cables at the Keysight Colorado Springs site that were literally wire pulled and built in the building. 10:00 Has anything changed as USB technology advances? There are a lot of new challenges - multiple challenges, retimers, multiple test modes Testing retimers is nontrivial, they are full receivers and full transmitter. 11:30 When a new spec is developed, what does that look like? How far does the test group go when setting a new spec? The spec doesn't look at how to test, it just looks it what it should do. Then, there's a compliance test specification (CTS). This is developed by a test group, that looks at how things should be tested. So, there are two groups. the first asks "what should the spec be?" and the second asks "how do we test that group?" 13:30 How many people are testing USB 3.2? Even though the compliance test specification is not developed yet? There are non being shipped, but there is a lot of activity! 14:30 What are the main challenges? Basics. When you have 10 Gbps over copper on a PCB, people are failing spec! There are issues with some devices passing only intermittently. Especially over long cables and traces. 15:45 Cheap PCBs make things even more tricky. So, there's very sophisticated transmitter equalization and even moire sophisticated receiver equalization. It's crucial to keep the low cost PCB material and processes to keep the overall end-product cost low. Using higher end materials would dramatically increase the cost of consumer products. 17:30 The first TV Mike bought was after his internship at Intel. He bought a $30-ish 1080i TV for $1600. Now, you couldn't give away that TV. 18:30 Stupid questions for Jit: What is your favorite national park and why? What is your favorite PCB material and why?
- 23min - 50 - USB 3.2 + Why You Only Have USB Ports On One Side of Your Laptop – #32
USB 3.2 DOUBLES the data transfer capabilities of previous USB specifications, and could mean the end of having USB ports on just one side of your computer. Find out more in today's electrical engineering podcast with Jit Lim, Daniel Bogdanoff, and Mike Hoffman. https://youtu.be/VEx6b6_XecI 1:00 Jit is the USB and Thunderbolt lead for Keysight. 1:30 USB 3.2 specifications were released Fall 2017 and released two main capabilities. USB 3.2 doubles the performance of USB 3.1. You can now run 10Gb/s x2. It uses both sides of the CC connector. In the x2 mode, both sides of the connectors are used instead of just one. 4:00 The other new part of USB 3.2 is that it adds the ability to have the USB silicon farther away from the port. It achieves this using retimers, which makes up for the lossy transmission channel. 5:00 Why laptops only have USB ports on one side! The USB silicon has to be close to the connector. 6:30 If the silicon is 5 or 6 inches away from the connector, it will fail the compliance tests. That's why we need retimers. 7:15 USB is very good at maintaining backwards compatibility The USB 3.0 spec and the USB 3.1 spec no longer exist. It's only USB 3.2. The USB 3.2 specification includes the 3.0 and the 3.1 specs as part of them, and acts as a special mode. 9:00 From a protocol layer and a PHY layer, nothing much has changed. It simply adds communication abilities. 9:55 Who is driving the USB spec? There's a lot of demand! USB Type C is very popular for VR and AR. 12:00 There's no benefit to using legacy devices with modern USB 3.2 ports. 13:45 There's a newly released variant of USB Type C that does not have USB 2.0 support. It repurposes the USB 2 pins. It won't be called USB, but it'll essentially be the same thing. It's used for a new headset. 15:20 USB Type C is hugely popular for VR and AR applications. You can send data, video feeds, and power. 17:00 Richie's Vive has an audio cable, a power cable, and an HDMI cable. The new version, though, has a USB Type-C that handles some of this. 18:00 USB 3.2 will be able to put a retimer on a cable as well. You can put one at each end. What is a retimer? A retimer is used when a signal traverses a lossy board or transmission line. A retimer acquires the signal, recovers it, and retransmits it. It's a type of repeater. Repeaters can be either redrivers or repeaters. A redriver just re-amplifies a signal, including any noise. A retimer does a full data recovery and re-transmission. 21:20 Stupid Questions: What is your favorite alt mode, and why? If you could rename Type-C to anything, what would you call it?
Thu, 02 Aug 2018 - 24min - 49 - Power Supply EMI + BW Woes – #31
Kenny shares his experience debugging 800 MHz EMC issues at an unnamed engineering site. The culprit? A power supply! Sometimes, that 1:1 probe just isn't enough... Daniel Bogdanoff and guest host Erin chat with Kenny Johnson about the impact of power supplies on conducted and radiated emissions. Video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YY5HoXkPQJE Links to discussed topics: Decoupling Capacitor Optimization for Power Integrity Webcast: https://www.keysight.com/main/eventDetail.jspx?cc=US&lc=eng&ckey=2908999&nid=-35724.0.08 Slides: https://www.keysight.com/upload/cmc_upload/All/29March2018WebcastSlides.pdf How to Design for Power Integrity Video Series: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLtq84kH8xZ9FNXAsf-odoGNe6h5A6D3in Slides: https://www.keysight.com/upload/cmc_upload/All/5_Power_Integrity_Ecosystem.pdf Kenny's Favorite Probe https://www.keysight.com/en/pd-1938466/high-voltage-probe-10001-30-kv-50-mhz?cc=US&lc=eng Agenda: 00:00 Kenny likes textbooks 1:30 Kenny is a power integrity expert 2:00 Mobile device design is hard, Kenny feels bad for designers 2:15 Power integrity is coupled in with their radio, and makes it hard to pass EMI and EMC 3:20 EMI/EMC is failing, but: Hardware guy has good data Software guy has good software Power guy looks to have no issues 4:45 FCC, ETSI 5:00 Types of EMI and EMC are: Conducted emissions Radiated emissions 6:00 Example: The IoT processor is only clocking at 5 MHz, but the EMC engineer is picking up noise up to 750-800 MHz. And, the system is dropping bits. 7:15 The 1:1 passive probe was hiding the higher frequency noise. Then, they were able to trigger on the power supply and see the noise in the data line - power supply induced jitter. A common rule of thumb is to have 20 MHz of bandwidth, but that's not always enough! 10:50 Optimizing decoupling capacitors. How to choose the right capacitors? Where to place decoupling capacitors? 11:50 Many complex components come with design guidelines (voltage regulators, capacitors, etc.). But, it shouldn't be treated as law. 13:00 Helpful resources 13:40 If you're working on more prosaic devices (they aren't crazy fast), even if you aren't having an EMI issue, the same part of the board that's having the EMI issues can also pollute the antennas. 14:30 How much bandwidth should you get? 15:25 Kenny connects to his device at full bandwidth, then pulls up an FFT. Then, he bandwidth limits to where the FFT rolls off. 16:15 A new power rail probe goes out to 6 GHz. Why do we need this much bandwidth? Higher BW noise! 18:00 Kenny saw a startup hub in Boston. It had a lot of different startups that pooled their collective resources to get access to higher end test equipment. 19:00 Kenny feels like the free tools are good for qualitative measurements, but not for quantitative measurements. 20:46 - Adam Savage - "Buy the cheapest tool first. If you break it, go buy a nice one." 21:30 Kenny is part of the inspiration for this podcast. 24:45 Stupid Questions: What's the worst possible power integrity advice you could possibly give to someone? What's your favorite probe and why?
- 27min - 48 - BONUS: EEs as Astronauts – Audio Exclusive
Astronaut Kay Hire answers the question: "What advice would you give to an engineer hoping to become an astronaut?"
- 2min - 47 - Weather CubeSats – #30
We have surprisingly little knowledge of weather. When specifically does a cloud rain? How do these clouds form? We don't have good answers to these questions. Getting those answers is an electrical engineering problem - one that a handful of professors and NASA are solving with CubeSats. Historically, we've used large satellites and ground-based systems to track weather patterns, but CubeSat arrays are becoming a viable option. In this episode, Daniel Bogdanoff sits down with the leading researchers in this area to hear about the challenges and advancements being made in this area. Interviewees: Charles Norton - JPL Engineering and Science Directorate POC Joel T Johnson - ECE Department Chair and Professor at The Ohio State University Christopher Ball - Research Scientist at The Ohio State University Dr. V. Chandrasekar (Chandra) - ECE Professor at Colorado State University Eva Peral - Radar Digital Systems Group Supervisor at JPL https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qBzMM1cW3YI Agenda Intro Space is changing. Big, expensive satellites used to be our only option. But, as you’ve probably heard on this podcast, when it comes to technology the world is always shrinking – and satellites are no exception. And that’s what we’re exploring today, specifically, the way cubesats (miniature satellites) are revolutionizing the way we look at earth’s weather. Hi, my name is Daniel Bogdanoff, and welcome to EEs Talk Tech. In our last episode, I brought you all along with me to Wallops flight facility in Virginia for a rocket launch. It was an eye-opening experience for me, and I wanted to cover more than was reasonable for a single episode. So today, we’re blending the style of last episode and our standard interview-style podcast. I sat down with some EE professors from Ohio State University and Colorado State University to talk about their cube sat projects – all of which monitor weather using radiometers or radar and are pretty high tech. I also apologize in advance for the background noise during the interviews, I’ve done the best I can to minimize the noise and voiceover parts I feel are hard to hear. I’ve also used clips from their NASA TV presentations wherever possible. Let’s get started, and hear a little bit about the advantages of CubeSats from Charles Norton. Advantages of CubeSats [1:05] Cubesats are nice not just because they’re cheaper and smaller. Thanks to the miniaturization of new technologies in both their physical size and their power consumption, we can deploy more systems, more rapidly, and at a lower cost. They also require smaller teams to develop and operate, and can even have higher measurement accuracy than existing assets. CubeRRT [3:51] At its core, CubeRRT is all about making radiometry measurements better by processing out man made emissions – leaving only the earth’s natural emissions. From NASA: "Microwave radiometers provide important data for Earth science investigations, such as soil moisture, atmospheric water vapor, sea surface temperature and sea surface winds. Man-made radiofrequency interference (RFI) reduces the accuracy of microwave radiometer data, thus the CubeSat Radiometer Radio Frequency Interference Technology Validation (CubeRRT) mission demonstrates technologies to detect and remove these unwanted RFI signals. Successful completion of the CubeRRT mission demonstrates that RFI processing is feasible in space, high volumes of data may be processed aboard a satellite, and that future satellite-based radiometers may utilize RFI mitigation." TEMPEST-D [8:00] Instead of having a big satellite sitting in geosynchronous orbit, an array of CubeSats can be put in orbit such that they each pass over the same spot at set intervals. With some careful calibration, differences in the measurement equipment gets normalized out and they get good weather data. From JPL: "TEMPEST-D is a technology demonstration mission to enable millimeter wave radiometer technologies on a low-cost, short de
- 19min - 46 - The Long Road to Space – #29
I went for a rocket launch, and stayed for the science. Have you ever wondered what it actually takes to get a rocket into space? And why we go there at all? I hadn't. Come with me on a behind the scenes tour of Wallops Flight Facility. Space balloons, sounding rockets, and a bonafide rocket launch! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rSXNDekILwU Links: Thank you again to Laurie Bonneau, John Mitchell, and John Huntington, NASA, and Orbital ATK/Northrup Grumman for letting me use your amazing photos! Check out Laurie B's Flickr page here John M's Flickr page here and John Huntington's coverage of the launch. Keysight oscilloscope probe promotion here. Agenda: 0:00 - Getting to Wallops Flight Facility 4:40 - "What's on Board" Science Briefings 8:03 - CubeSats 9:32 - Concrete in Space? 11:10 - Cold Atom Laboratory and Bose Einstein Condensates 15:09 - Launch Pad 0A Visit 15:50 - Horizontal Integration Facility (HIF) 19:29 - Range Control Center 21:23 - Space Balloons 24:25 - Sounding Rocket Machine Shop and Test Lab 28:53 - Astronaut Kay Hire 31:04 - OA9 rocket launch day! Transcript: On the Virginia coast, hours away from any major airport, you’ll find what appears to be a sleepy little town. It’s not a tourist town or a beach town, that’s further down the road. Driving through, you’ll see an abandoned roller rink and billboards for opioid abuse programs, a retro country radio station, and the seafood restaurant in the next town over. There’s a single diner is nestled in a gas station, right across the street from a house with a half dozen American flags and a huge “support our troops” sign in the front yard. But when you drive a little further, you might start to wonder if there’s more to this town than meets the eye. Down the road from the diner is the smallest Lockheed Martin building I’ve ever seen. Drive a minute longer, and the forest clears. Immediately, you know there’s more to this town. Your eyes are first drawn to giant satellite communication antennas, and then to radar installations and what look to be airplane hangers emblazoned with the NASA logo. Of course, all of this is surrounded by fences with stern warnings for trespassers and loiterers – keeping gawkers at bay, leaving them to wonder what’s going on in there. Thanks to you, who follow us on YouTube and the EEs Talk Tech podcast, I wasn’t left to wonder. And now, neither are you. NASA granted me and select others special access to tour the facilities. So, what is this place? Turns out, it’s a lot of things. The most exciting role of this place, for me anyways, is that it’s the site of Antares rocket launches. Twice per year, this sleepy, backwoods town wakes up with a start. The world’s top engineers, scientists, and researchers flock to the town. Wide-eyed high school students working the counter at the lone diner try desperately to feed a line of people that stretches out the door. The hotels in the area are completely booked. Because this weekend, we’re going to space. Have you ever wondered what makes a place like this tick? There’s an entire economy and ecosystem dedicated to keeping it afloat. I always thought the rocketry aspect was the main attraction, but never gave much thought to the actual point of it all. Space is pretty cool, but what does humanity actually gain by getting there? That’s what we’re going to look at today. We’re going to explore the science. Go past those warning-ridden fences. Take a look at some of the projects that get a lot of press, and some that are less glamorous. Then we’re going to look at how those projects get deployed. And yes, that includes a rocket launch. Here we go. Day 1. It’s Friday, May 18th. For me, it means travel day. One of the reasons Wallops Flight Facility is a great location is that there’s, quote “virtually unimpeded airspace.” For visitors, this means you have to drive from your major airport of choice for at least a couple hours. So, it’s gonna be a long day. I figure I’ll
- 37min - 45 - PAM4 and 400G – Ethernet #18
Today's systems simply can't communicate any faster. Learn how some companies are getting creative and doubling their data rates using PAM4 - and the extra challenge this technology means for engineers. Mike Hoffman and Daniel Bogdanoff sit down with PAM4 transmitter expert Alex Bailes and PAM4 receiver expert Steve Reinhold to discuss the trends, challenges, and rewards of this technology. https://youtu.be/D5Op5EaJsPM 1:00 PAM isn't just cooking spray. What is PAM4? PAM stands for Pulse Amplitude Modulation, and is a serial data communication technique in which more than one bit of data can be communicated per clock cycle. Instead of just a high (1) or low (0) value, a in PAM4, a voltage level can represent 00, 01, 10, or 11. NRZ is essentially just PAM2. We are reaching the limit of NRZ communication capabilities over the current communication channels. 2:10 PAM has been around for a while, it was used in 1000BASE-T. 10GBASE-T uses PAM16, which means it has 16 different possible voltage levels per clock cycle. It acts a bit like an analog to digital converter. 2:55 Many existing PAM4 specifications have voltage swings of 600-800 mV 3:15 What does a PAM4 receiver look like? A basic NRZ receiver just needs a comparator, but what about multiple levels? 3:40 Engineers add multiple slicers and do post-processing to clean up the data or put an ADC at the receiver and do the data analysis all at once. PAM4 communicates 2-bits per clock cycle, 00, 01, 10, or 11. 4:25 Radio engineers have been searching for better modulation techniques for some time, but now digital people are starting to get interested. 4:40 With communications going so fast, the channel bandwidth limits the ability to transmit data. PAM4 allows you to effectively double your data rate by doubling the amount of data per clock cycle. 5:05 What's the downside of PAM4? The Signal to Noise Ratio (SNR) for PAM4 worse than traditional NRZ. In a perfect world, the ideal SNR would be 9.6 dB (for four levels instead of two). In reality, it's worse, though. 5:30 Each eye may not be the same height, so that also has an effect on the total SNR. 6:05 What's the bit error ratio (BER) of a PAM4 vs. NRZ signal if the transmission channel doesn't change? 6:45 The channels were already challenged, even for many NRZ signals. So, it doesn't look good for PAM4 signals. Something has to change. 7:00 PAM4 is designed to operate at a high BER. NRZ typically specified a 1E-12 or 1E-15 BER, but many PAM4 specs are targeting 1E-4 or 1E-5. It uses forward error correction (or other schemes) to get accurate data transmission. 7:50 Companies are designing more complex receivers and more robust computing power to make PAM4 work. This investment is worth it because they don't have to significantly change their existing hardware. 8:45 PAM is being driven largely by Ethernet. The goal is to get to a 1 Tb/s data rate. 9:15 Currently 400 GbE is the next step towards the 1 Tbps Ethernet rate (terabit per second). 10:25 In Steve's HP days, the salesmen would e-mail large pictures (1 MB) to him to try to fill up his drive. 11:10 Is there a diminishing rate of return for going to higher PAM levels? PAM3 is used in automotive Ethernet, and 1000BASE-T uses PAM5. Broadcom pushed the development of PAM3. The goal was to have just one pair of cables going through a vehicle instead of the 4 pairs in typical Ethernet cables. Cars are an electrically noisy environment, so Ethernet is very popular for entertainment systems and less critical systems. Essentially, Ethernet is replacing FlexRay. There was a technology battle for different automotive communication techniques. You wouldn't want your ABS running on Ethernet because it's not very robust. 14:45 In optical communication systems there is more modulation, but those systems don't have the same noise constraints. For digital communications, PAM8 is not possible over today's channels because of the noise. 15:20 PAM4 is the mai
- 29min - 44 - Heterogeneous Computing & Quantum Engineering – #17
Learn about parallel computing, the rise of heterogeneous processing (also known as hybrid processing), and the prospect of quantum engineering as a field of study! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p0TwhacA0AI Audio link: 00:40 Parallel computing used to be a way of sharing tasks between processor cores. When processor clock rates stopped increasing, the response of the microprocessor companies was to increase the number of cores on a chip to increase throughput. 01:44 But now, the increased use of specialized processing elements has become more popular. A GPU is a good example of this. A GPU is very different from an x86 or ARM processor and is tuned for a different type of processing. GPUs are very good at matrix math and vector math. Originally, they were designed to process pixels. They use a lot of floating point math because the math behind how a pixel value is computed is very complex. A GPU is very useful if you have a number of identical operations you have to calculate at the same time. 4:00 GPUs used to be external daughter cards, but in the last year or two the GPU manufacturers are starting to release low power parts suitable for embedded applications. They include several traditional cores and a GPU. So, now you can build embedded systems that take advantage of machine learning algorithms that would have traditionally required too much processing power and too much thermal power. 4:50 This is an example of a heterogeneous processor (AMD) or hybrid processor. A heterogeneous processor contains cores of different types, and a software architect figures out which types of workloads are processed by which type of core. Andrew Chen (professor) has predicted that this will increase in popularity because it's become difficult to take advantage of shrinking the semiconductor feature size. 6:00 This year or next year, we will start to see heterogeneous processors (MOOR) with multiple types of cores. Traditional processors are tuned for algorithms on integer and floating point operations where there isn't an advantage to doing more than one thing at a time. The dependency chain is very linear. A GPU is good at doing multiple computations at the same time so it can be useful when there aren't tight dependency chains. Neither processor is very good at doing real-time processing. If you have real time constraints - the latency between an ADC and the "answer" returned by the system must be short - there is a lot of computing required right now. So, a new type of digital hardware is required. Right now, ASICs and FPGAs tend to fill that gap, as we've discussed in the All about ASICs podcast. 9:50 Quantum cores (like we discussed in the what is quantum computing podcast) are something that we could see on processor boards at some point. Dedicated quantum computers that can exceed the performance of traditional computers will be introduced within the next 50 years, and as soon as the next 10 or 15 years. To be a consumer product, a quantum computer would have to be a solid state device, but their existence is purely speculative at this point in time. 11:50 Quantum computing is reinventing how processing happens. And, quantum computers are going to tackle very different types of problems than conventional computers. 12:50 There is a catalog on the web of problems and algorithms that would be substantially better on a quantum on a computer than a traditional computer. 13:30 People are creating algorithms for computers that don't even exist yet. The Economist estimated that the total spend on quantum computing research is over 1 Billion dollars per year globally. A huge portion of that is generated by the promise of these algorithms and papers. The interest is driven by this. Quantum computers will not completely replace typical processors. 15:00 Lee's opinion is that the quantum computing industry is still very speculative, but the upsides are so great that neither the incumbent large computing
- 24min - 43 - Quantum Bits and Cracking RSA – #16
How will quantum computing change the future of security? What does a quantum computer look like? Mike and Daniel sit down with Lee Barford to get some answers. Video Version: https://youtu.be/2rZswtUjwag Audio version Last time we looked at "what is quantum computing" and talked about quantum bits and storing data in superstates. 00:40 Lee talks about how to crack RSA and Shor's algorithm (wikipedia) 00:50 The history of quantum computing (wiki). The first person to propose it was Richard Feynman in the mid 1960s. There was some interest, but it died out. In the 1990s, Peter Shor published a paper pointing out that if you could build a quantum computer with certain operational properties (machine code instructions), then you could find one factor of a number no matter how long it is. Then, he outlined another number of things he would need, like a quantum Fast Fourier Transform (FFT). Much of the security we use every day is both the RSA public key system and the Diffie Hellman Key Exchange algorithm. HTTPS connections use the Diffie Hellman Key Exchange algorithm. RSA stands for "really secure algorithm" "Rivest, Shamir, and Adelman." 4:00 RSA only works if the recipients know each other, but Diffie Hellman works for people who don't know each other but still want to communicate securely. This is useful because it's not practical for everyone to have their own RSA keys. 5:00 Factoring numbers that are made up of large prime numbers is the basis for RSA. The processing power required for factoring is too large to be practical. People have been working on this for 2500 years. 6:45 Shor's algorithm is theoretically fast enough to break RSA. If you could build a quantum computer with enough quantum bits and operate with a machine language cycle time that is reasonable (us or ms), then it would be possible to factor thousand bit numbers. 7:50 Famous professors and famous universities have a huge disparity of opinion as to when a quantum computer of that size could be built. Some say 5-10 years, others say up to 50. 8:45 What does a quantum computer look like? It's easier to describe architecturally than physically. A quantum computer isn't that much different from a classical computer, it's simply a co-processor that has to co-exist with current forms of digital electronics. 9:15 If you look at Shor's algorithm, there are a lot of familiar commands, like "if statements" and "for loops." But, quantum gates, or quantum assembly language operations, are used in the quantum processor. (more about this) 10:00 Lee thinks that because a quantum gate operates in time instead of space, the term "gate" isn't a great name. 10:30 What quantum computers exist today? Some have been built, but with only a few quantum bits. The current claim is that people have created quantum computers with up to 21 quantum bits. But, there are potentially a lot of errors and noise. For example, can they actually maintain a proper setup and hold time? 11:50 Continuing the Schrodinger's Cat analogy... In reality, if you have a piece of physics that you've managed to put into a superimposed quantum state, any disturbance of it (photon impact, etc.) will cause it to collapse into an unwanted state or to collapse too early. 13:15 So, quantum bits have to be highly isolated from their environments. So, in vacuums or extreme cold temperatures (well below 1 degree Kelvin!). 13:45 The research companies making big claims about the quantity of bits are not using solid state quantum computers. The isolation of a quantum computer can't be perfect, so there's a limited lifetime for the computation before the probability of getting an error gets too high. 14:35 Why do we need a superposition of states? Why does it matter when the superimposed states collapse to one state? If it collapses at the wrong time you'll get a wrong answer. With Shor's algorithm it's easy to check for the right answer. And, you get either a remainder of 0 or yo
- 25min - 42 - What is Quantum Computing?- #15
What is a quantum computer and what is quantum computing? In this week's episode, Daniel Bogdanoff and Mike Hoffman are joined by quantum computing expert Lee Barford. Video Version (YouTube): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_AZ0IqgAs6k Audio Only: 0:45 Intro Lee Barford helps to guide Keysight into the quantum computing business + enables the quantum computing experts at Keysight 2:00 The importance of quantum computing Clock rates in all types of digital processors stopped going up in 2006 due to heating limits The processor manufacturers realized the need for more parallelism. Today, Lee helps engineers at Keysight take advantage of this parallelism. Graphics processors can be used as vector and matrix machines Bitcoin utilizes this method. 6:00 The implications of advancements in quantum computing Today, there are parts being made with feature size of the digital transistor that are 10, maybe 7 nanometers (depending on who you believe) So we are heading below 5 nanometers, and there aren't many unit cells of silicon left at that point. (a unit cell of silicon is 0.5 nanometer) The uncertainty principle comes into play since there are few enough atoms where quantum mechanical effects will disturb the electronics. There are many concerns including a superposition of states (Schrodinger's cat) and low error tolerance. 10:20 Is Moore's law going to fail? Quantum computing is one way of moving the computer industry past this barrier Taking advantage of quantum mechanical effects, engineering with them, to build a new kind of computers that for certain problems, promise to do better than what we currently do. 15:20 Questions for future episodes: What sort of technology goes into a quantum computer? What's the current state of experimentation? What are some of the motivations for funding quantum computing research? How is Keysight involved in this industry? What problems is quantum computing aiming to solve? 17:30 Using quantum effects to our advantage Quantum computers likely be used in consumer devices because there has to be a very low temperature and/or a vacuum. 18:00 A quantum computer's fundamental storage unit is a qubit (quantum bit). A quantum bit (qubit) can be either 1 or 0 with some finite probability 19:00 A quantum register can store multiple qubits, and when read, have a probability of being either of these numbers. A quantum register can store more than one state at a time, but only one value can be read from the quantum register. 21:00 How does one get a useful value out of a quantum register? You do as much of the computation before reading the state and then read the quantum computers quantum register. This works because the quantum computer's either has such a high probability to be correct that you don't need to verify it, or it's simple to double check if the answer is correct. 21:00 How do you get the desired value out of a quantum register? You do as much of the computation ahead of time and then read the quantum computers quantum register. 22:30 Quantum computers can factor very large numbers (breaking RSA in cryptography)
- 23min - 41 - How to Price Your Electronics Hardware Project – #14
Daniel Bogdanoff and Mike Hoffman sit down with Brig Asay to talk about how to price a hardware project. Listen in as they discuss the complexities of pricing a new hardware product in a global economy. Follow Brig Asay on Yelp @baasay. Video Version (YouTube): https://youtu.be/k5pZuaMez9c Audio Only: 0:00 Intro How should you price hardware? 1:45 Tell us in the comments what you think our green screen should be! 2:00 Economics 101: Supply & Demand This is how we generally set prices for hardware 2:40 Top down pricing takes into account your cost of manufacturing. But if you price based on production costs, you're going to fail in your pricing. It's all about what consumers are willing to pay. 4:00 Pharmaceutical companies are the example of bad pricing schemes. They justify high prices based on high R&D costs. But the reality is that consumers don't care about R&D costs. They care about how bad they need the product, and this will determine how much they are willing to pay. 4:30 Someone on EEVblog hacked a 3000T, reverse engineering it to make it a 1 GHz scope. 5:30 The newer the idea, the harder it is to price because there's no real market value. Talking to potential customers is a good way to start pricing in white space. 6:45 Marketing 101: Who are your customers? Determining who you are trying to sell to and talking with them can help with pricing. Competitor pricing is a good baseline, but then you often get into value-based pricing. 7:50 Spreadsheets are the killer of pricing. They compete with your gut feeling. $10K per GHz of bandwidth is a standard in oscilloscope pricing, but it doesn't always apply. When we came out with the Infiniium Z-Series, a 63 GHz scope, we knew the market couldn't support a $630K price. 9:00 Price/volume curve = Supply and demand chart 10:50 Different regions have different pricing expectations. Currency, cultural expectations, and import taxes all come into play when considering regional pricing. Should a small company even worry about regional pricing? 16:40 You need to be willing to adjust pricing. Dynamics of the market and the value of your product can change over time. If you're not selling anything, you need to adjust your price. Priced too low and people may have the perception that you're selling a low-quality product. 19:20 Pricing too low may also inadvertently shrink your market size. Overly undercutting your competitor may hurt you in the long-run. 23:15 Does the psychological side to pricing always apply? What's the stigma around prices ending in a 9 or 8? 25:00 Stupid Questions with Mike: What is your favorite price and why? What is your favorite currency and why? 27:40 Tell us about your software or hardware project in the comments!
- 28min - 40 - The World’s Fastest ADC – #13
We talk to ASIC Planner Mike Beyers about what it takes to design the world's fastest ADC in today's electrical engineering podcast. Video Version (YouTube): https://youtu.be/2NLzJBhdlv4 Audio Only: Intro: Mike is an ASIC planner on the ASIC Design Team. Prestudy, learn about making an ASIC. 00:30 What is an ADC? An ADC is an analog to digital converter, it takes analog data inputs and provides digital data outputs. What's the difference between analog and digital ASICs? 1:00 There are three types of ASICs: 1.Signal conditioning ASICs 2. Between 1 and 3 is a converter, either digital to analog (DAC) or analog to digital (ADC) 3. Signal processing ASICs, also known as digital ASICs 1:50 Signal conditioning ASICs can be very simple or very complicated e.g. Stripline filters are simple, front end of an oscilloscope can be complicated 2:45 There's a distinction between a converter vs. an analog chip with some digital functionality A converter has both digital and analog. But there are some analog chips with a digital interface, like an I2C or SPI interface. 4:25 How do you get what's happening into the analog world onto a digital interface, and how fast can you do it? 4:35 Mike Hoffman designed a basic ADC design in school using a chain of operational amplifiers (opamps) A ladder converter, or "thermometer code" is the most basic of ADC designs 6:00 A slow ADC can use single ended CMOS, a faster ADC might use parallel LVDS, now it's almost always SERDES for highest performance chips 6:35 The world's fastest ADC? 6:55 Why do we design ADCs? We usually don't make what we can buy off the shelf. The Nyquist rate determines the necessary sample rate, for example, a 10 GHz signal needs to be sampled at 20 - 25 Gigasamples per second 1/25 GHz = 40 ps 8:45 ADC Vertical resolution, or the number of bits. So, ADCs generally have two main specs, speed (sample rate) and vertical resolution. 9:00 The ability to measure time very accurately is often most important, but people often miss the noise side of things. 9:45 It's easy to oversimplify into just two specs. But, there's more that hast to be considered. Specifications like bandwidth, frequency flatness, noise, and SFDR 10:20 It's much easier to add bits to an ADC design than it is to decrease the ADCs noise. 10:42 Noise floor, SFDR, and SNR measure how good an analog to digital converter is. SFDR means "spurious free dynamic range" and SNR means "signal to noise ratio" 11:00 Other things you need to worry about are error codes, especially for instrumentation. For some ADC folding architectures and successive approximation architectures, there can be big errors. This is acceptable for communication systems but not for visualizing equipment. 12:30 So, there are a lot of factors to consider when choosing ADC. 12:45 Where does ADC noise come from? It comes from both the ADC and from the support circuitry. 13:00 We start with a noise budget for the instrument and allocate the budget to different blocks of the oscilloscope or instrument design. 13:35 Is an ADC the ultimate ASIC challenge? It's both difficult analog design and difficult high-speed digital design, so we have to use fine geometry CMOS processes to make it happen. 15:00 How fast are our current ADCs? 160 Gigasamples per second. 15:45 We accomplish that with a chain of ADCs, not just a single ADC. 16:15 ADC interleaving. If you think about it simply, if you want to double your sample rate you can just double the number of ADCs and shift their sampling clocks. But this has two problems. First, they still have the same bandwidth, you don't get an increase. Second, you have to get a very good clock and offset them carefully. 17:00 To get higher bandwidth, you can use a sampler, which is basically just a very fast switch with higher bandwidth that then delivers the signal to the ADCs at a lower bandwidth But, you have to deal with new problems like intersymbol interference (ISI). 18:20 So, what ar
- 26min - 39 - How Internet is Delivered – Data Centers and Infrastructure – #12
Laser-delivered Netflix and backyard data centers! The conversation continues with optical communications guru, Stefan Loeffler. In this episode, Daniel Bogdanoff and Mike Hoffman discuss optical infrastructure today and what the future holds for optics. Video version (YouTube): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wZOO5yzUXcU Audio Version: Discussion Overview: Optical Communication Infrastructure 00:30 Optics = Laser-driven Netflix delivery system Client-side vs line-side 1:00 Line-side is the network that transports the signals from the supplier to the consumer Client-side is the equipment that is either a consumer or business, accepting the data from the network provider. Yellow cables in your wall indicate presence of fiber 1:40 Technically, optics is communication using radiation! But it is invisible to us as humans. 2:20 Getting fiber all the way to the antenna is one of the major new technologies 2:30 But this requires you to have power at the antenna 2:45 However, typically there is a "hotel" or base station at the bottom of the antenna where the power is and where fiber traditionally connects, instead of up to the antenna Really new or experimental antennas have fiber running all the way up the pole 3:28 Network topologies- star, ring, and mesh 3:42 Base stations are usually organized in star-form, or a star network pattern. A star network starts at a single base station and distributes data to multiple cells Rings (ring networks) are popular in metro infrastructure because you can encircle an entire area 4:20 Optical rings are like traffic circles for data. Is ring topology the most efficient or flexible? 6:20 An advantage of ring and mesh topologies is built-in resilience Mesh topologies have more bandwidth but require more fiber optic cable 7:10 How often is the topology or format of a network defined by geography or regulations? 8:30 How consumers get fiber 9:20 Business or academic campuses typically utilize mesh networks on the client side, subscribing to a fiber provider Fiber itself or a certain bandwidth using that fiber can be leased If you're a business, like a financial institution, and latency or bandwidth is critical, leasing fiber is necessary so you have control over the network 9:45 What's the limiting factor of optical? What are the limitations of the hardware that's sending/receiving optical signals? 11:08 Whatever we do in fiber, at some point, it is electrical 11:27 There will be a tipping point where quantum computing and photon-computing (optical computing) comes into play 11:40 Will optical links ever compete with silicon? Maybe we will have optical computers in the future 12:02 The limiting factor is the power supply 12:40 What's costing all this energy? 12:58 The more data (bits and bytes) we push through, the more energy in the form of optical photons or electrons we are pushing through. We also must use a DSP for decoding which costs energy One of the first 100 Gb links between two clients was between the New York Stock Exchange and the London Stock Exchange 14:00 The evolution of the transmission of data 14:45 Will we ever have open-air optical communication? 15:50 RF technology uses open-air communication today, but it is easy to disturb The basic material fiber is made of is cheap (silica, quartz), and can be found on any beach 16:08 Whereas copper has a supply problem and, thus, continues to increase in price Other uses for optical 16:33 Crystal fiber and multicore fiber is being experimented with to increase the usable bandwidth Optical, as waveguides, can be built into small wafer sections 17:15 Optics is used in electrical chips when photons are easier to push through than electrons Cross-talk can happen with optical, too 18:13 Testing is done with optical probing, which works because of optical coupling Optical-to-electrical converter solution Optical satellite communication 19:48 Hollow-fiber could be used in a vacuum, such as space The r
- 34min - 38 - Copper vs. Fiber Optic Cable and Optical Communication Techniques – #11
Mike Hoffman and Daniel Bogdanoff continue their discussion with Stefan Loeffler about optical communication. In the first episode, we looked at "what is optical communication?" and "how does optical communication work?" This week we dig deeper into some of the latest optical communication techniques and advances in the industry as well as the use of fiber optic cable in electronics and long-range telecommunication networks. Video version (YouTube): https://youtu.be/sZXxltWJwIU Audio Version: Discussion Overview: Installation of optical fiber and maintenance of optical fiber We can use optical communication techniques such as phase multiplexing There’s a race between using more colors and higher bitrates to increase data communication rates. Indium doped fiber amplifiers can multiply multiple channels at different colors on the same optical PHY. You can use up to 80 colors on a single fiber optic channel! 3:52 How is optical communication similar to RF? Optical communication is a lot like WiFi 4:07 Light color in optical fiber is the equivalent of carrier frequencies in RF How do we increase the data rate in optical fiber? There are many multiplexing methods such as multicore, wavelength division, and polarization 4:50 Practically, only two polarization modes can be used at once. The limiting factor is the separation technology on the receiver side. 6:20 But, this still doubles our bandwidth! What about dark fiber? Dark fiber is the physical piece of optical fiber that is unused. 7:07 Using dark fiber on an existing optical fiber is the first step to increasing fiber optic bandwidth. But wavelengths can also be added. Optical C-band vs L-band 7:48 Optical C-band was the first long-distance band. It is now joined by the L-band. Is there a difference between using different colors and different wavelengths? Optical fibers are a light show for mosquitos! 8:30 How do we fix optical fibers? 10:36 For short distances, an OTDR or visual light fault detectors are often used by sending red light into a fiber and lights up when there's a break in the fiber Are there other ways to extend the amount of data we can push through a fiber? 11:35 Pulses per second can be increased, but we will eventually bleed into neighboring channels Phase modulation is also used PAM-4 comes into play with coding (putting multiple bits in a symbol) And QAM which relies on both amplitude and phase modulation PAM-4 test solutions How do we visualize optical fibers? 14:05 We can use constellation diagrams which plot magnitude and phase Do we plan for data error? 15:00 Forward error correction is used, but this redundancy involves significant overhead QAM vs PAM 64 Gigabot (QAM-64) was the buzzword at OFC 2017 16:52 PAM is used for shorter links while QAM is used for longer links How do we evaluate fiber? 18:02 We can calculate cost per managed bit and energy per managed bit Energy consumption is a real concern 18:28 The race between copper and fiber 19:13 Fiber wins on long distance because of power consumption But does fiber win on data rate? Google Fiber should come to Colorado Springs...and Germany! To compensate for the loss of the signal on the distance, you push more power in for transmitting and decrypting Fibers attenuate the signal much less than copper does But the problem comes when we have to translate the signal back into electrical on the receiving end Is there a break-even point with fiber and copper? 22:15 Optical communication technology in the future What speed are we at now and what’s the next technology? 23:05 600 G technology will be here eventually We can expect 1.5 years between iterations in bandwidth. This is really slow in terms of today's fast-paced technology. We typically see 100 G speeds today Predictions 26:00
- 28min - 37 - All About ASICs – #10
The future will be built using ASICs! Daniel Bogdanoff and Mike Hoffman sit down with chip sage and planner Mike Beyers to discuss the challenges of building custom application specific integrated circuits. This podcast was inspired by the blog post "Creating an ASIC - Our Quest to Make the Best Cheap Oscilloscope" Video version (YouTube): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jGKY29t-uQs Audio version: Discussion Overview: We’re finally a real podcast now! What is an ASIC? An ASIC is an application specific integrated circuit, an IC designed for a specific task. Why do we use ASICs? ASIC architecture 101 2:46 The main specification people talk about is the size smallest thing you can find on a chip - like the gate of a CMOS transistor Effective gate length is shorter than the gate length drawn because of the manufacturing process. Another key spec is how many transistors you can fit in a square mm Metal layers for interconnects are also more important, but can cause the mask sets to be more expensive Do we care more about a gate's footprint or its depth? 4:11 Will Moore’s Law hit a ceiling? 4:29 What about using three dimensional structures? 5:37 Is Moore’s Law just a marketing number? 5:51 Does technology ever slow down? 6:29 Power is often the largest limiter 6:58 Google builds data centers next to hydroelectric dams 7:34 Battery power 7:43 Power drives cost 7:53 How does the power problem affect ASICs? 8:25 There are power integrity and thermal management concerns Dedicated routes on an ASIC vs switching on an FPGA 8:14 Who actually uses ASICs? 10:14 IOT technology - 7 nm and 14nm chips A lot of people are using older technology because it's much more affordable (like 45 nm) ASICs on your bike could be a thing? 11:16 SRAM wireless electronic bike shifters 11:57 Is bike hacking a real thing? Yes! Encrypted wireless communication helps prevent it. Is an opamp (operational amplifier) an ASIC? What to consider when investing in an ASIC 13:23 What’s the next best alternative to building this ASIC? With an ASIC, you can often drive lower cost, but you also increase performance and reliability Is there a return on investment? 14:24 What happens when Moore’s Law hits a dead end with transistors? 14:46 Could we replace electrical with optical? 15:30 Is it possible that there other fundamental devices out there, waiting to be discovered? 16:20 The theoretical fourth device, the memristor 17:00 Will analog design ever die? Mike was told to get into digital design. Non-binary logic could be the future 18:23 If someone wants and ASIC, how do they get one? 18:50 In-house design vs. external fabs/foundries, total turnkey solutions vs. the foundry model You can get a cheaper chip by going to a larger architecture, but the chip will run hotter and slower. RTL - Most common code languages Verilog or VHDL vs. higher level languages like C 22:50 Behavioral Verilog vs. Structural Verilog 24:00 The history of Keysight ASICs 25:45 Predictions 28:40 How to connect with us 29:00
- 29min - 36 - Optical 101 – #9
Optical communication 101 - learn about the basics of optics! Daniel Bogdanoff and Mike Hoffman interview Stefan Loeffler. Video Version (YouTube): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HWV7Yd1OGa0 Audio version: Discussion overview: Similarities between optical and electrical Stefan was at OFC What is optics? 1:21 What is optical communication? 1:30 There's a sender and a receiver (optical telecommunication) Usually we use a 9 um fiber optic cable, but sometimes we use lasers and air as a medium The transmitter is typically a laser LEDs don't work for optical Optical fiber alignment is challenging, and is often accomplished using robotics How is optical different from electrical engineering? Photodiodes act receivers, use a transimpedance amplifier. It is essentially "electrical in, electrical out" with optical in the middle. Optical used to be binary, but now it's QAM 64 Why do we have optical communication? A need for long distance communication led to the use of optical. Communication lines used to follow train tracks, and there were huts every 80 km. So, signals could be regenerated every 80 km. In the 1990s, a new optical amplifier was introduced. Optical amplifier test solutions Signal reamplifcation vs. signal regeneration There's a .1 dB per km loss in modern fiber optic cable 11:20 This enables undersea fiber optic communication, which has to be very reliable How does undersea communication get implemented? Usually by consortium: I-ME-WE SEA-ME-WE AT&T was originally a network provider What is dark fiber (also known as dark fibre)? Fiber is cheap, installation and right-of-way is expensive What happens if fiber breaks? Dark fiber can be used as a sensor by observing the change in its refractive index Water in fiber optic line is bad, anchors often break fiber optic cable 17:30 Fiber optic cable can be made out of a lot of different things Undersea fiber has to have some extra slack in the cable Submarines are often used to inspect fiber optic cable You can find breaks in the line using OTDR - "Optical time domain reflectometry" A "distributed reflection" means a mostly linear loss. The slope of the reflection tells you the loss rate. The refractive index in fiber optic cable is about 1.5 Latency and delay 23:00 The main issue is the data processing, not the data transmission A lot of optical engineers started in RF engineering 24:00 Environmental factors influence the channel, these include temperature, pressure, and physical bends Recently thunderstorms were found to have an effect on the fiber channel Distributed fiber sensing is used drilling Polarization in fiber, polarization multiplexing techniques Currently, we're using 194 THz, which gives 50 nm windows Future challenges for optical 28:25 It's cost driven. Laying fiber is expensive. And, when all dark fiber is being used, you have to increase bandwidth on existing fiber. Shannon relation 30:00 Predictions 31:10 Watch the previous episode here!
- 32min - 35 - Producer and Consumer Risk – #8
Learn more about producer risk and consumer risk! Mike Hoffman, Daniel Bogdanoff, and Matthew Woerner discuss various aspects of the risk involved in manufacturing and buying goods. Audio player: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ci3s6ASV8VM More about calibration: http://www.keysight.com/find/americas_cal Discussion Overview: What is consumer risk and producer risk? There's always risk, so how do you manage it? What should consumers do to be safe? How are producers testing their products before selling them? The history of the ballpoint pen is a good object lesson for producers @7:00 Are lifetime warranties just a marketing ploy? Lifetime warranty transfers consumer risk into producer risk As a producer how do you decide how long your warranty should be? How to build reliability models for products 10:30 How can we predict a failure rate for a product? We have use temperature chamber and other test techniques. How do you balance AFR (annualized failure rate) with the risk of experiencing catastrophic failure ? What is a false accept? What is the "escape rate," what is a false pass ? A false accept is the term for test results that should have failed, but instead pass. How do you avoid catastrophic issues in production? 15:15 How accurate can you really be? How accurately can you measure something that takes time? Is there a guide for the uncertainty of measurements? Traceability is important for making reliable measurements Fill up your gas tank early in the morning and you get more gas What should you do now? 20:00 What is margin stackup? Everything in a device has margin, so margin stackup is the combination of all uncertainties. Calibration is a very wide industry, it doesn't just apply to test and measurement! Think, car alignments, etc. What is Matthew's biggest challenge? 24:23 How do you make sure your measurements are accurate? Predictions 28:00 Some companies test products based on the region that product is being sold into, as different regions can have different quality expectations.
- 31min - 34 - AI Ethics and Autonomous Vehicles – #7
How do we handle the ethical dilemmas that arise when building increasingly capable and intelligent systems? AI is all around us- likely a part of your phone, home systems, and even cars. Autonomous cars offer greater convenience, safety, and efficiency, but is the world ready to tackle the corresponding ethical dilemmas? Video (YouTube): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YBIz8ouOMGk Follow Brig Asay on Yelp @baasay. Discussion Overview: AI Ethics Restaurant Reviews by AI 01:41 Self-driving (autonomous) cars AI ethical dilemma and AI decision liability What about consumer liability? AI decision-making without human interaction 07:25 The three stages of AI Artificial Narrow Intelligence (ANI also known as "weak AI"), Artificial General Intelligence (AGI), Artificial Super Intelligence (ASI) 07:48 AI consciousness, AI ethical standards, and self-replicating AI Humanoid robots Should AI be allowed to replicate itself? 10:16 Task-based AI using computers Is there a need to program AI to have morals and ethics? The prisoner's dilemma and game theory Challenges of marketing self-driving cars Autonomous buses emulating human behavior Should AI have to follow local laws and regulations? 17:50 Telemetry tracking autonomous vehicles for speed monitoring Self-programmable FPGAs and neural network simulations Can a computer be evil? 26:30 EEs Talk Tech Electrical Engineering podcast
- 32min - 33 - Frog Legs Helped Discover the Volt – #6
Do you know how the volt was discovered? It might surprise you! Daniel Bogdanoff, Mike Hoffman, and Matthew Woerner discuss the volt's wild history and more in this week's EEs Talk Tech podcast. Video (YouTube): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bgc017zt5qs Discussions Overview: The volt and building batteries Volta discovered the Volt (article) Capital vs. Lower case SI units The Greeks knew about static electricity It's not that hard to build a basic battery How do potato batteries work? 4:30, 10:30 How do lemon batteries work? The invention of electrostatic generators and storage in Leiden jars Who were Galvani and Volta? Galvani started experimenting with static electricity Mike simply assumes frog legs are delicious Galvani was skinning a frog leg for some experiments and the frog leg kicked! Why and how did the leg kick? Galvani vs. Volta Galvani believed in "animal electricity," but Volta thought it was just electricity Galvani is considered to be the father of bioelectromagnetics Mike thinks plants crave electrolytes Redox reactions make biobatteries work (like frog leg batteries and ox head batteries) Galvani's nephew performed demonstrations on more than just animal tissue Mary Shelley and the fabled origin of Frankenstein Volta and the invention of the Voltaic Stack (or Voltaic Pile) The first light bulb was demonstrated for the Royal Society in London What is the volt now? Mike was born just in time to browse dank memes Why is it called "natural philosophy" - Because there was much study of the mind (Greeks), and technology finally allowed natural philosophers to study nature. Wikipedia tip Back in the day, scientists had to understand a lot of different disciplines Famous scientific rivalries over time - is Edison vs. Tesla over hyped? Predictions: Maker movement We want EEs Talk Tech fan fiction. We forgot Mike's prediction 23:25 EEs Talk Tech is an electrical engineering podcast by Keysight Technologies
- 24min - 32 - The Seven Ways we Describe the Universe (SI Units) – #5
The entire universe can be described using just seven different units! These are the metre, kilogram, second, ampere, kelvin, mole, and candela and are defined by the The International System of Units (SI) as the seven base units through which all other units can be derived. Learn more about these standard units, their interesting history, and relevance today. Daniel Bogdanoff, Mike Hoffman, and Matthew Woerner discuss. Video (YouTube): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jl4I0jg63sI Discussion Overview: What is Metrology? Meteorology vs Metrology What are SI Units and what is the international system of units? Why do we even have SI units? The history of the yard, where does the word "ruler" come from? The specific value of the kilogram (kg) Basics of the kilogram and how we define mass 07:00 The kilogram has sister units. Units of measure defined by constants in the universe are helpful because they don't change. What makes up a second? (Uses a cesium atom's vibrations) What are base SI units? 12:06 What are derived SI units? Derived SI units are units of measurement that can be found by selectively combining the seven base SI units. For example, the volt. What is the difference between base and derived SI units? Electrical current, the Ampere, and Electromagnetics 15:00 What is the triple point of a substance? It is the temperature and pressure at which a substance's gas, liquid, and solid states coexist What are moles (chemistry) - the quantity of a substance 20:20 What is a candela? (Luminous intensity) Planck's constant is important! How to use Planck's equation The Watt balance is replacing the physical versions of the kilogram 26:16 Mike's amazing water bottle flip 38:53 EEs Talk Tech is an electrical engineering podcast from Keysight Technologies
- 39min - 31 - Under the Hood of PCI Express – #4
Peripheral Component Interconnect Express, officially abbreviated as PCIe® or PCI Express®, is a computer expansion bus standard designed to replace the older bus standards such as PCI. PCIe 4.0 is doubling the data rate of PCIe 3.0 and poses some interesting challenges for designers. Learn more about PCIe, what it is and how it affects your PC's performance & capabilities. Daniel Bogdanoff, Mike Hoffman, and Rick Eads discuss. Video (YouTube): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2zX-uO8CXfc Discussion Overview: Intro 00:00 Rick Eads is "PCI-Eads" 13:00 Rick's background with PCIe - He's been around since the beginning PCIe 1.0 Rick spent time on the PCI-SIG board of directors 50:00 PCI-SIG means "Peripheral Component Interconnect Special Interest Group" Signal integrity, transmitters, receivers (PCIe PHY Layer) 1:00 What is PCIe? What is PCI Express? 1:20 PCIe means Peripheral Component Interconnect Express Used to have the ISA bus, ISA means Industry Standard Architecture 1:40 Which transitioned to PCI, but that wasn't fast enough 1:55 Gaming has driven overclocking 2:00 PCIe is revolutionary 2:25 PCI and ISA was parallel but, PCIe is serial 2:40 PCIe is scalable 3:00 PCIe lanes use lanes that are a differential TX (transmit) and a differential RX (Receiver)3:09 You can have 1 lane (x1, "by one") up to at least 32 lanes 3:30 PCIe is starting to be used for storage 4:35 Storage with PCIe is popular thanks to solid state drives NVMe (also called NVM Express) uses PCIe PHY layer 5:25 NVMe means "Non-Volatile Memory Host Controller Interface Specification" SATA & SAS involve sectoring and writing onto "RUST" (iron oxide) It turns out that sand is faster than rust! 6:00 It's in consumer-grade equipment now 6:45 m.2 is on most motherboards, and takes an SSD drive running NVMe or SATA express NVMe is targeted more towards servers but NVMe's speed and reliability makes it more of a standard interface 7:40 When is PCIe used? 8:05 PCIe is designed to be an interoperability 8:20 The "Root Complex" is the host, like a motherboard, the "Peripheral" is the card 8:40 Why does the PCI-SIG exist? 9:15 The point is that you can be interoperable, the device should work with all other similar devices PCI-SIG holds interoperability workshop events 11:00 The first rule of the interoperability workshop is we don't talk about the interoperability workshop 11:30 Engineers have brought in products covered in giant trashbags with a port sticking out 11:50 Thunderbolt is a combination of PCIe and Displayport 13:00 But it doesn't leverage the "collateral," the written spec but instead borrows the theory of operation from PCIe How does Thunderbolt work with the PCI-SIG? 13:30 PCI express is a variant of the PHY portion of InfiniiBand (IB), which is a computer networking standard A Physical layer is called a PHY Motherboard designers don't want to build a lot of PHYs, they want something universal 14:15 Industry tries to build universal PHYs 15:00 PCI express is used in some mobile devices 15:10 Because PCI express has some low power states Some cars use a PCI express connection for connecting the rear view camera to the rear view mirror display How far can you transmit PCI express? 16:15 There is a cable version of PCI express You can use an active cable 16:30 There are some proprietary systems that use a repeater The repeater transmits a proprietary signal to a receiver that converts it back to PCIe PCI express 4.0 (PCIe Gen 4) 17:45 The PCI express Gen 4 feature set has been fixed 18:05 It's not final-final 18:30 PCIe has used a 0.7 version as a sort of a trial run 18:40 PCIe Gen 3 equalization changed from 0.7 to 3.0 and a nonlinear equalizer was implemented 18:45 PCIe Gen 4 is different 19:15 PCI express Gen 4 looks a lot like PCI express Gen 3 19:30 PCI express Gen 4 20:00 The average link length on a motherboard is 10 inches, a server is about 20 inches This architecture can't change, so the speed has to increase Insertion
- 32min - 30 - Wireless Charging – #3
Wireless charging is growing in popularity! Learn about the difference between inductive and resonant techniques, as well as who's implementing the technology (it might surprise you!). Daniel Bogdanoff, Brig Asay, and Johnnie Hancock discuss. Video (YouTube): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xsC5_ML8J88 Discussion Overview: Intro 00:00 Efficiency measurements for wireless charging system 01:02 Basics of wireless charging 01:53 Phones without built-in wireless charging functionality Phone case to enable wireless charging 02:05 Wireless charger and phone as primary and secondary transformer 02:16 Magnetic Inductive vs Magnetic Resonant techniques for Wireless Charging Magnetic resonance versus inductance for wireless charging 02:39 Magnetic inductance 02:54 Qi technology 03:05 Rezence/Airfuel/A4WP (alliance for wireless power) Magnetic inductance runs at a lower frequency 03:21 Device communication - "ping" 03:30 Load change, load modulation, handshaking 03:39 Spool of wire as load 04:05 Two main states - polling/power save 04:23 Magnetic resonance 04:39 Proximity of device to charging pad for magnetic inductance charging 05:00 Charge multiple devices wirelessly with magnetic resonance using one large charging coil 05:31 Can you mount a charging pad under table/surface? 05:46 Surface material types that do and do not allow charging 06:07 Where is wireless charging available? Integration of wireless charging into non-electronic devices 06:28 New infrastructure - Furniture makers, coffee shops 06:52 Wireless charging pads built into furniture 07:01 Magnetic inductance, built into surface of furniture 07:06 Coffee shops in the future may have wireless charging in the tables and counters Wireless charging might not be free 07:35 Near field communication (NFC) 07:52 Is wireless charging secure? There's a possibility of data transfer (non power-related information) 08:04 Magnetic resonance has parallel communication path 08:39 Bluetooth protocol will be used to transfer more information 08:51 Wireless charging in cars and furniture Automotive integration of wireless charging 09:36 Why is this better than plugging the phone in directly? 10:24 Wireless chargers embedded in furniture Sold at furniture stores 11:18 Standards for distance from charging pad 12:26 Charging from far distances using repeater systems and magnetic resonance 14:28 How to tune a wireless charging device Tuning a wireless charging device 15:01 Network analyzer for tuning, impedance matching 15:12 Oscilloscopes can also be used for tuning Why don't we have this technology everywhere right now? 15:44 Slowed down by lack of a single standard 16:06 Magnetic resonance versus inductance for future technology 16:34 Companies and standards - one technology will win Influencers of the consortium - manufacturers, tech companies, etc. 18:54 Trade offs 19:31 Efficiency, cost, multiple devices What is the efficiency of wireless charging? 20:12 Wireless charging efficiency for bigger device - electric car 20:45 Safety, government regulations 21:18 Texas A&M professor - what does electric radiation do to people? 22:07 NFC - Apple Pay, Samsung Pay, etc. 22:38 Wirelessly charge wearables, medical implants 23:16 Wireless charging pacemakers How much power can we really transfer wirelessly? 24:53 Charging all devices inside a single room? Predictions for the future of wireless power 26:24 Read Johnnie's wireless charging application notes: Part 1: Measurements during the power transfer state Part 2: Measurements during the power save state Part 3: Power and efficiency measurements
- 28min - 29 - Artificial Intelligence and Dispersed Computing – #2
How is the world of processors changing, and what does it mean for the future of AI? Daniel Bogdanoff and Brig Asay sit down to talk about it. Video (YouTube): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=10_8c-nkfOg Discussion overview: Intro 00:00 Intel acquisition of Altera 00:45 What does it mean for Intel to buy an FPGA company? What is "dispersed computing" 1:17 Microprocessors used to handle everything Then, GPUs became integrated 1:45 Offloading computing from a microprocessor 2:02 One option is to use an FPGA to share computing 2:10 ASIC vs FPGA 2:15 ASICs aren't flexible 2:45 FPGAs give more flexibility than an ASIC 3:03 We use both FPGAs and ASICs in our instruments 3:25 Parallel vs serial buses 3:35 PCIe is x16, other tech going well past 2 and 4 lanes 4:00 This is helpful, but it adds a lot of design complexity We're starting to see 5:00 PCIe, USB, SerDes used to dominate but now we're seeing some other technologies like Generation Z and CCIX (Cache Coherent Interconnect for Accelerators) 6:00 Makes designs faster to market and easier to debug Generation Z (Gen-Z) 6:25 Generation Z and CCIX build on PCIe technology Why are these technologies coming out? 7:00 PCIe takes a lot of work to implement 7:35 So these technologies are less stringent 8:00 and are more open 8:15 We see a lot of PCIe Gen 2 that will start to be replaced by Gen-Z or CCIX type buses internally 8:30 How does the microprocessor connect to other chips in the design? 9:05 That's the biggest opportunity for speed increases Thunderbolt has been around for a while 9:45 But, Thunderbolt is finally taking off 10:00 It used to be an internal bus, but now we're starting to see it externally on consumer devices What are the next major tasks that will be offloaded? 10:25 AI, machines learning from themselves 11:00 "If true artificial intelligence happens, there's no way a microprocessor can do it all" 11:10 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Big_data Big data is huge, and that requires a lot of processing and computing 11:32 A processor and a server won't be able to do it alone 11:50 Is this because there's too much data? (it's two-fold) 12:10 1. There's tons of data 12:45 2. We want to know the answer right away FPGAs/ASICs are currently doing a "filtering" of data which then feeds into a central processor 13:15 Right now, FPGAs are handling very specific tasks 13:56 Intel acquires Altera, which is a good indicator of where the industry is going 14:15 The FPGA is going to get smarter and smarter 14:50 Are FPGAs too slow? 15:15 What do designers need their FPGAs to do? 16:10 Companies creating FPGAs know that they have to have higher performance at lower cost 16:30 NVIDIA, Google, Facebook are all releasing their own chips FPGA part costs will likely drop in the next 5 years as a result 17:20 Is there a blend of FPGAs and ASICs? 18:00 We're seeing FPGAs starting to be implemented on data centers and servers 18:15 Using FPGAs instead of ASICs there for their flexibility Servers lead the PC/consumer market in technology 18:45 Server loads are an order of magnitude greater than PC loads Hyperscaling 19:40 Historically, you had storage, servers, and routers all separate. Now, they're getting smarter with resource allocation Localized vs remote dispersed computing 21:20 All the data has to go somewhere, there's not a lot of point to point Latency is becoming more of an issue 22:00 Is processor technology plateauing? 22:30 Consumers generally don't need a lot more processing power as of today, but servers do Are multiple core processors a harbinger of FPGAs taking on more tasks? 23:55 AI is becoming more and more important 25:05 There's nothing more debated than artificial intelligence 25:40 We're using it in a minimalist way 26:00 A "large tech company" had an AI go on Twitter and it didn't work out very well 26:35 What is it going to take to make AI something that is integral to our daily life? 27:05 For data centers, AI is going to play a role in adjusting to th
- 33min - 28 - USB Type-C – #1
What does USB Type-C mean for the world? Daniel Bogdanoff and Mike Hoffman sit down with Jit Lim to find out. We discuss super fast charging, blazing data transfer - and, of course, things catching fire as a result. Video version (YouTube): What does USB Type-C mean for the world? Daniel Bogdanoff (@Keysight_Daniel) and Mike Hoffman sit down with Jit Lim to find out. We discuss super fast charging, blazing data transfer transfer - and, of course, things catching fire as a result. Watch the video version and ask us any questions you might have on the Keysight Oscilloscopes YouTube channel or in the comments below! Look for new episodes each 2nd and 4th Thursday. Visit Keysight's USB Type-C design and test solutions page for app notes and more! Discussion overview: What is the EEs Talk Tech podcast? What is USB Type-C, one port to end all others! Reversible plugs Show and tell -Superspeed USB, micro USB USB Type-C cables are the same on both ends Host/Device Source/Sink vs role negotiation USB Power Delivery (USB PD) overview USB PD for USB A was deprecated USB Type-C charger has 60 watts of power! Charge your phone very quickly using USB PD 10:00 5V is an hobby-industry standard level, what about going forwards? What does USB Type-C look like for day-to-day life? LED projectors? USB Noodle makers? Q: Can I find a cheap USB Type-C cable? Should I? A: Probably over time, but if it's poorly made it could go badly Phones are literally blowing up! The cable isn't just a wire anymore 14:59 USB alt modes: USB is the cable to end all cables! It can handle Displayport, HDMI, VGA, DVI, Thunderbolt, ethernet, power, headphones MHL device discussion No headphone jack needed!?! Is USB Type-C available in stores? Are manufacturers pushing Type-C or are consumers demanding it? USB A to C, USB B to C, Thunderbolt to USB C adapters are allowed in the USB C spec (USB Type-C specification) Make sure to look for USB Certification when you buy products USB IF mandates that products be certified before being sold A bad USB Type-C implementation can destroy your stuff! How are USB alt modes implemented? What makes up the hardware? 20:20 All USB Type-C cables & hardware have to be the same! CC (Configuration Channel) line starts the handshake and is a dedicated pin Make sure cables only have one CC! 21:40 USB Type-C is reversible! 22:20 The device receptacle does the signal routing based on cable position and orientation How does device negotiation work? For example, what if two phones want to charge each other? A device can be a host (sinking) or a device (sourcing) 24:20 How does it happen? 24:45 RP, RD, RA resistor network is fundamental to Type-C What do the resistors mean? RP means "always a source" RD means "always a sink" These resistor networks have certain values that determine current, etc. You can have USB Type-C without PD, up to 5 Volts 3 Amps USB Type-C PD lets you go to 20V 5A We have two USB test fixtures/USB test jig the N7015A and N7016A Is USB PD available today? Temperature sensors (or other fail safe mechanisms) are required 28:00 Are USB Type-C cables active or passive? In general, USB Type-C cables are passive. Active USB Type-C cables will be used for longer cables. All USB Type-C cables are required to have an e-mark chip to help with power negotiation 29:15 Not all USB Type-C cables can handle 100W USB Type-C can go up to 80 Gb data transfer using four TX/RX links! There's a lot of room to grow for future USB Type-C revisions 32:10 Predictions 30:30
- 34min - 27 - DDR5 Rx Testing is a Whole New Ballgame – #28
Receiver testing (Rx) was never a concern for DDR design. Until now. The margin for error ran out, and now Rx testing is getting standardized. We sit down with Stephanie Rubalcava to explore the challenges of this new ground. Video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bl9p3nwOJ5U Audio: Agenda: 1:00 This is the first time in the industry that high-accuracy, standardized receiver measurements need to be done 2:20 DDR is very different from traditional memory in terms of testing 3:10 Process of getting specs defined 3:50 What a DDR receiver test (DDR Rx Test) looks like 4:50 Even being just 100 mV off when testing can make a part appear to fail 5:20 The BERT sends out a signal to test the channel, but what's really being tested is the DIMM and device's ability to receive data under certain conditions 6:30 Receiver types across different devices? There's a DQS data clock signal, and a data signal. There are also command and address lines in DDR. 6:50 For Rx testing, we're calibrating the signal going into the receiver 7:30 JEDEC develops a lot of the testing standards 8:10 Two components of test standards: compliance and characterization. Compliance asks "do I meet the spec?" Characterization asks "how well does my system perform, and where is my fail point?" 9:35 Receiver test as whole is a challenge for engineers They need new kinds of calibration, DDR fixtures, and tests. 12:20 DDR Transmitters (DDR Tx) are progressing with DDR5 as well as receivers. We do have the DDR Tx history testing all the way back to DDR1. There are similar specifications for characteristics of DDR transmitters and DDR receivers. 13:20 DDR Transmitter testing is at "the ball of the part" and checks for signal characteristics.
- 15min - 26 - Battlebots 2018 & the Hardcore Robotics Team – #27
"I tend to not turn Tombstone on outside of the arena. It scares the crap out of me..." - Ray Billings, Hardcore Robotics team captain. We sit down with BattleBots' resident bad boy to talk about the engineering behind the world's meanest fighting robots. We also talk robot carnage. Because we know you're really here for robot carnage. https://youtu.be/Wc4g_f0YeI8 Agenda: 00:03 Ray Billings leads the Hardcore Robotics Battlebots team, and is the “resident villain” on Battlebots. 00:40 Mike went to high school with Ray’s son 01:15 Ray’s robot, “Tombstone” is ranked #1 on the Battlebots circuit. Highlights here. 1:34 The winner trophy for Battlebots is a giant nut. 2:00 Ray doesn’t turn on the robot very often outside of the arena 2:35 Ray’s carnage story: he bent a 1” thick titanium plate 3:20 You have to see combat robots live to get the full experience 4:10 The first match of Battlebots 2018 should be one of the most epic Battlebots fights of all time 4:30 Ray has done over 1,000 combat robot matches in 17 years 5:00 How Ray got into Battlebots 6:25 The main robot is called an offset horizontal spinner. It spins a 70-75 lb bar at 2500 rpm. 7:40 The body is 4130 choromoly tubing. The drive motors were intended for an electric wheelchair, and the weapons motor is from an electric golf cart. 8:20 Normal electrical motors are not designed to work for combat robots. Ray significantly stresses the motors. 8:50 The weapon motor was designed to be used at 48V 300A, but Ray uses it at 60V and 1100A (at spinup). This would overheat and destroy the motor, so it shouldn’t be done long-term. 9:40 – 70-80kW at spinup, and no start capacitor. He just uses a big marine relay. 10:00 Ray’s robot has 1 second to be lethal 10:30 If there’s a motor-stall potential mid match, Ray will turn off the motor to save batteries/electronics 11:00 What’s the weak point of Ray’s robot? One match, the weapon bar snapped in half. 11:40 Ray uses tool-grade steel, so it won’t bend, it’ll just snap. 12:40 The shock loads can break the case. The weapon motor looks like it’s rigidly mounted, but because it’s on a titanium plate it has some shock absorber. There’s also a clutch system in the sprocket to help offset shock. 13:40 Ray’s robot has to take all of the force that the opponent’s robots do (equal and opposite), but if it’s coming in a direction you want vs. one you don’t want you can design-in protection. 14:40 What test challenges were faced during assembly and design? It’s been highly iterated. There are no shortcuts for designing combat robots. You have to see where something breaks, then adjust. 15:45 When Ray started in 2004, his robot was just a “middle of the pack” robot. With years of iteration, it’s now a class-dominant robot. 16:45 Ray spins up the robot at least once before a competition. It’ll pick up debris from the ground and throw it around. 17:50 Battery technology and batteries for combat robots: Originally they used lead acid batteries for their current ability. Now, almost everyone uses Lithium chemistry. The sport is about power-to-weight ratio, so the lighter batteries have given people much more flexibility. 19:00 Why aren’t there gas powered combat robots? There are some that have flamethrowers, and there are a couple gas powered ones. However, they aren’t as dependable. 20:15 Ray has wrecked arenas. The arena rails are 1/2” steel, and Ray can cut a soda-can sized hole in them. He’s wrecked panels and ceiling lights. 21:20 Combat robot communication systems: today everything runs on 2.4 GHz digitally encoded systems. They often use RC plane controls because they are highly customizable and there are a lot of available channels. 22:00 Drive systems: the wheels & motors come together. They use a hard foam in the tires so you can’t get a flat. 22:45 Centrifugal force – not a huge problem because the blade spins in-plane. But, when he gets bumped up the blade fights gravity before it can self-right.
- 33min - 25 - Secret Specs, LPDDR5, and Interposers – #26
Keeping specs secret is just part of the job. Getting a usable, working spec is another. We sat down with Jennie Grosslight to learn why JEDEC guards a spec, the basic DDR architecture, and geek out about the challenges of probing DDR. Hosted by Daniel Bogdanoff and Mike Hoffman, EEs Talk Tech is a twice-monthly engineering podcast discussing tech trends and industry news from an electrical engineer's perspective. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=opPsgSrDCOo Agenda: 1:00 How are electrical engineering and protocol specifications defined? 2:00 Bigger companies tend to drive specifications because they can afford to put money into new products Sometimes small or midsize companies with an idea can make something new happen, but they have to push it 2:50 Most memory technologies have a couple players: 1. The chipset and the memory controller industry 2. The actual devices that store data (DRAM) 3:30 There's a tremendous amount of work between all the players to make all the parts work together. 5:00 Why JEDEC keeps information about new products private as they're being developed: If you spread your information too wide then you can get a lot of misinformation. Fake news! Early discussions also might not resemble the end product 6:20 DDR5, LPDDR, and 3D silicon die stacking are new and exciting in memory 7:00 We keep pushing physics to new edges 7:20 Heat management in 3D silicon is a big challenge 8:20 LPDDR5 is the new low power memory for devices like cell phones and embedded devices 9:10 5G devices will likely depend on low power memory 10:20 Once the RF challenges of 5G are figured out there will be even more challenges on the digital side. Systems have to deal with large bandwidths and low latencies 11:10 Higher performance and lower power is driving development of LPDDR5 It will be interesting to see if improvements are made in jumps or very slowly 12:00 Dropping voltage swing and increasing speed both make the eye smaller Making the eye smaller makes you more vulnerable to crosstalk 12:20 - Completely closed eyes for DDR5 13:00 How to probe DDR? We use a lot of simulation because the circuits are so sensitive 14:20 Crosstalk is often a problem when making DDR and LPDDR measurements 14:50 Economics drives everything so new technology is often based on existing systems 15:40 What comes next is up to who comes up with the best idea 16:40 What will drive change is when the existing materials can no longer meet performance 17:50 Power is important for big data farms as well as cell phones 19:50 GDDR and DDR 21:00 Chipset rank on a DIMM The pieces share a common data bus so you need to know the order to properly test 24:20 DIMM interposer used for logic measurements for servers 25:50 With a scope a ball grid array is used under a device or the pins are probed Oscilloscope interposers are available that work similarly to the logic analyzer interposers The logic analyzer looks at all the signals at once, typically the oscilloscope only looks at a few 28:10 When testing you want to validate that the device followed the protocal in the right sequence 29:10 Data rates of DDR DDR5 is supposed to get to 6400 MT/s
- 32min - 24 - DDR5 and 3D Silicon – #25
"You reach critical certain thresholds that are driven by the laws of physics and material science" - Perry Keller DDR5 marks a huge shift in thinking for traditional high-tech memory and IO engineering teams. The implications of this are just now being digested by the industry, and opening up doors for new technologies. In today's electrical engineering podcast, Daniel Bogdanoff and Mike Hoffman sit down with Perry Keller to discuss how engineers should "get their game on" for DDR5. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2qCeUVjtZs Audio: Sign up for the DDR5 Webcast with Perry on April 24, 2018! Agenda: 00:20 Getting your game on with DDR5 LPDDR5 6.4 gigatransfers per second (GT/s) "You reach critical certain thresholds that are driven by the laws of physics and material science" - Perry Keller 1:00 We're running into the limits of what physics allows 2:00 DDR3 at 1600 - the timing budget was starting to close. 2:30 With DDR5, a whole new set of concepts need to be embraced. 3:00 DesignCon is the trade show - Mike is famous for his picture with ChipHead 4:00 Rick Eads talked about DesignCon in the PCIe electrical engineering podcast 4:40 The DDR5 paradigm shift is being slowly digested 4:50 DDR (double data rate) introduced source synchronous clocking All the previous memories had a system clock that governed when data was transferred. Source synchronous clocking is when the system controlling the data also controls the clock. Source synchronous clocking is also known as forward clocking. This was the start of high speed digital design. At 1600 Megatransfers per second (MT/s), this all started falling apart. For DDR5, you have to go from high speed digital design concepts to concepts in high speed serial systems, like USB. The reason is that you cant control the timing as tightly. So, you have to count on where the data eye is. As long as the receiver can follow where that data eye is, you can capture the information reliably. DRAM doesn't use an embedded clock due to latency. There's a lot of overhead, which reduces channel efficiency 9:00 DDR is single ended for data, but over time more signals become differential. You can't just drop High Speed Serial techniques into DDR and have it work. The problem is, the eye is closed. The old techniques won't work anymore. 10:45 DDR is the last remaining wide parallel communication system. There's a controller on one end, which is the CPU. The other end is a memory device. 11:15 With DDR5, the eye is closed. So, the receiver will play a bigger part. It's important to understand the concepts of equalizing receivers. You have to think about how the controller and the receiver work together. 12:20 Historically, the memory folks and IO folks have been different teams. The concepts were different. Now, those teams are merging 13:00 DDR5 is one of the last steps before people have to start grappling with communication theory. Modulation, etc. 14:10 Most PCs now will have two channels of communication that's dozens or hundreds of bits wide. 14:45 What is 3D silicon? If 3D silicon doesn't come through, we'll have to push more bits through copper. 3D silicon is nice because you can pack more into a smaller space. 3D silicon is multiple chips bonded together. Vias connect through the chips instead of traces. The biggest delay for 3D silicon is that it turns on its head the entire value delivery system. 7 years ago, JEDEC started working on wide IO 17:15 What's the difference between 3D silicon and having it all built right into the processor? It's the difference between working in two dimensions and three dimensions. If you go 3D, you can minimize footprint and connections 18:45 Flash memory, the big deal has been building multiple active layers. 19:45 The ability to stack would be useful for mobile. 21:45 Where is technology today with DDR? DDR4 is now mainstream, and JEDEC started on DDR5 a year ago (2017)
- 24min - 23 - Memory, DDR5+, and JEDEC – #24
"It's a miracle it works at all." Not the most inspiring words from someone who helped define the latest DDR spec. But, that's the the state of today's memory systems. Closed eyes and mV voltage swings are the topic of today's electrical engineering podcast. Daniel Bogdanoff (@Keysight_Daniel) and Mike Hoffman sit down with Perry Keller to talk about the state of memory today and it's inevitable march into the future. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uan7gQ82tWY Agenda: 00:00 Today's guest is Perry Keller, he works a lot with standards committees and making next generation technology happen. 00:50 Perry has been working with memory for 15 years. 1:10 He also did ASIC design, project management for software and hardware 1:25 Perry is on the JEDEC board of directors JEDEC is one of the oldest standards body, maybe older than IEEE 1:50 JEDEC was established to create standards for semiconductors. This was an era when vacuum tubes were being replaced by solid state devices. 2:00 JEDEC started by working on instruction set standards 2:15 There are two main groups. A wide bandgap semiconductors group and a memory group. 3:00 Volatile memory vs. nonvolatile memory. An SSD is nonvolatile storage, like in a phone. But if you look at a DIMM in a PC that's volatile. 3:40 Nonvolatile memory is everywhere, even in light bulbs. 4:00 Even a DRAM can hold its contents for quite some time. JEDEC had discussions about doing massive erases because spooks will try to recover data from it. DRAM uses capacitors for storage, so the colder they are the longer they hold their charge. 4:45 DRAM is the last vestige of the classical wide single ended parallel bus. "It's a miracle that it works at all." 5:30 Perry showed a friend a GDDR5 bus and challenged him to get an eye on it and he couldn't. 6:10 Even though DDR signals look awful, it depends on reliable data transfer. The timing and clocking is set up in a way to deal with all of the various factors. 7:00 DDR specifications continue to march forward. There's always something going on in memory. 8:00 Perry got involved with JEDEC through a conversation with the board chairman. 8:35 When DDR started, 144 MT/s (megatransfers per second) was considered fast. But, DDR5 has and end of life goal of 6.5 GT/s on a 80+ bit wide single ended parallel bus. 9:05 What are the big drivers for memory technology? Power. Power is everything. LPDDR - low power DDR - is a big push right now. 9:30 if you look at the memory ecosystem, the big activity is in mobile. The server applications are becoming focused with the cloud, but the new technology and investment is mobile. 10:00 If you look at a DRAM, you can divide it into three major categories. Mainstream PC memory, low power memory, and GDDR. GDDR is graphics memory. The differences are in both power and cost. For example, LPDDR is static designs. You can clock it down to DC, which you can't do with normal DDR. The first DDR was essentially TTL compatible. Now, we're looking at 1.1V power supplies and voltage swings in the mV. Semiconductor technology is driving the voltages down to a large degree. 11:45 DRAM and GDDR is a big deal for servers. A company from China tried to get JEDEC to increase the operating temperature range of DRAMs by 10 C. They fire up one new coal fired power plant per week in China to meet growing demand. They found they could cut it down to only 3 per month with this change in temperature specs. 13:10 About 5 years ago, the industry realized that simply increasing I/O speeds wouldn't help system performance that much because the core memory access time hasn't changed in 15 years. The I/O rate has increased, but basically they do that by pulling more bits at once out of the core and shifting them out. The latency is what really hurts at a system level. 14:15 Development teams say that their entire budget for designing silicon is paid for out of smaller electric bills. 15:00 Wide bandgap semiconductors are happy r
- 24min - 22 - Data Analytics for Engineering Projects – #23
It seems most large labs have a go-to data person. You know, the one who had to upgrade his PC so it could handle insanely complex Excel pivot tables? In large electrical engineering R&D labs, measurement data can often be inaccessible and unreliable. In today's electrical engineering podcast, Daniel Bogdanoff (@Keysight_Daniel) sits down with Ailee Grumbine and Brad Doerr to talk about techniques for managing test & measurement data for large engineering projects. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=atsZlEx0WTg Agenda: 1:10 - Who is using data analytics? 2:00 - for a hobbyist in the garage, they may still have a lot of data. But, because it's a one-person team, it's much easier to handle the data. Medium and large size teams generate a lot of data. There are a lot of prototypes, tests, etc. 3:25 - The best teams manage their data efficiently. They are able to make quick, informed decisions. 4:25 - A manager told Brad, "I would rather re-make the measurements because I don't trust the data that we have." 6:00 - Separate the properties from the measurements. Separate the data from the metadata. Separating data from production lines, prototype units, etc. helps us at Keysight make good engineering decisions. 9:30 - Data analytics helps for analyzing simulation data before tape out of a chip. 10:30 - It's common to have multiple IT people managing a specific project. 11:00 - Engineering companies should use a data analytics tool that is data and domain agnostic. 11:45 - Many teams have an engineer or two that manage data for their teams. Often, it's the team lead. They often get buried in data analytics instead of engineering and analysis work. It's a bad investment to have engineers doing IT work. 14:00 - A lot of high speed serial standards have workshops and plugfests. They test their products to make sure they are interoperable and how they stack up against their competitors. 15:30 - We plan to capture industry-wide data and let people see how their project stacks up against the industry as a whole. 16:45 - On the design side, it's important to see how the design team's simulation results stack up against the validation team's empirical results. 18:00 - Data analytics is crucial for manufacturing. About 10% of our R&D tests make it to manufacturing. And, manufacturing has a different set of data and metrics. 19:00 - Do people get hired/fired based on data? In one situation, there was a lack of data being shared that ended up costing the company over $1M and 6 months of time-to-market.
- 24min - 21 - Radar and Electronic Warfare -#22
Phil Gresock, Keysight's Radar Lead, sits down with us to discuss the basics of radar and give us a peek into the world of aerospace electronic warfare. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ScwCCTozNuY Agenda: 00:20 Adaptive cruise control for cars works really well. 1:00 the history of radar - the original radar display was an oscilloscope in WWII. (radar test equipment) http://www.pearl-harbor.com/georgeelliott/scope.html 1:45 Early warning radar 2:00 The rumor that carrots are good for your eyesight was a British misinformation campaign. 2:58 The British had the "chain home radar system" all along the coast that pointed to their western front. They wanted early warning radar because they had limited defensive forces. By knowing what was coming, they could allocate defenses appropriately. 3:45 Radar originally was a defensive mechanism. 3:50 How does radar work? You send out a pulse that is modulated on a carrier frequency. If that pulse gets reflected back, we can do some math and work out how far away something is. 4:30 Typically, there's a specific frequency used. For long range radar, like search and early warning radar, a lower frequency is used. 5:15 What does a modern radar system look like? It depends on the application. Early warning systems are often anchored on old oil rigs. The rigs have a radome installed on them. 6:25 How does radar detect something so small and so far away? A lot of it depends on the frequencies and processing techniques you use. 6:40 There are some radar techniques you can use, for example bouncing off of the sea, the earth, the troposphere. 7:15 Radar also has some navigational benefits. For example, wind shear flying into Breckenridge airport. A change in medium is measurable. 8:10 Radars also get installed on missiles to do some last-minute corrections. 8:35 Ultimately, the goal of radar is to detect something. You're trying to figure out range, elevation (azimuth), velocity, etc. Different target sizes and ranges require different pulse widths, different frequencies, etc. Azimuth is easy to determine because you know what direction your radar is pointing. To detect velocity with radar you can use doppler shift. 10:30 Radar cross section analysis gives even more information. 11:00 There are spheres in space for radar calibration. You can send pulses to the sphere and measure what you get back. Radar calibration sphere in low earth orbit: http://www.dtic.mil/docs/citations/ADA532032 (for full paper, click the "full text" link) 11:40 There are also reflectors on the moon so you can use laser telescopes to measure the reflection. Mirrors on the moon: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lunar_Laser_Ranging_experiment 12:30 NASA put reflectors in space. 12:58 So, you send a pulse out and get a return signal, but there was a scattering effect. There are libraries for what a return pulse for different objects looks like so you can identify what you are looking at. 14:00 Radar counter intelligence techniques. First, you have to know you are being painted by radar. Military jets have a number of antennas all around it. And, you generally know what radars are being used in a theater of operation. So, there will be a warning that will let you know you are being painted by a certain type of radar. 15:30 Get Daniel on a fighter jet 16:05 How do you stop your radar from being detected or interfered with? There are a few techniques. Radar frequency hopping is changing the frequency used from pulse to pulse. Radar frequency modulation changes the modulation pulse to pulse - phase shifts, amplitude changes, frequency chirps, etc. This helps avoid detection, get better performance, or reduce susceptibility to jamming. If you know how your radar responds to different signals, you have a lot of flexibility in what signal you use. How do you spoof a radar? You have to know what is incident upon you and know how that will act over time. You can send out pulses advanced or lagging in
- 24min - 20 - Intro to RF – EEs Talk Tech Electrical Engineering Podcast #21
We sit down with Phil Gresock to talk about the basics of RF for "DC plebians." Learn about RF designs, radio frequencies, RADAR, GPS, and RF terms you need to know in today's electrical engineering podcast! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xZlpOXjaxTI Agenda: RF stands for radio frequency 00:40 Phil Gresock was an RF application engineer 1:15 Everything is time domain, but a lot of RF testing tools end up being frequency domain oriented 2:15 Think about radio, for example. A tall radio tower isn’t actually one big antenna! 3:50 Check out the FCC spectrum allocation chart 4:10 RF communication is useful when we want to communicate and it doesn’t make sense to run a cable to what we're communicating to. 4:50 When you tune your radio to a frequency, you are tuning to a center frequency. The center frequency is then down converted into a range 6:30 Check out Mike’s blog on how signal modulation works: 7:00 Communication is just one use case. RADAR also is an RF application. 8:10 The principles between RF and DC or digital use models are very similar, but the words we use tend to be different. Bandwidth for oscilloscopes means DC to a frequency, but for RF it means the analysis bandwidth around a center frequency 9:22 Cellular and FCC allocation chart will talk about different "channels." Channel in the RF world refers to frequency ranges, but in the DC domain it typically refers to a specific input. 10:25 Basic RF block diagram: First, there’s an input from an FPGA or data creating device. Then, the signal gets mixed with a local oscillator (LO). That then connects to a transmission medium, like a fiber optic cable or through the air. Cable TV is an RF signal that is cabled, not wireless. Then, the transmitted signal connects to an RF downcoverter, which is basically another mixer, and that gets fed into a processing block. 13:50 Tesla created a remote control boat and pretended it was voice controlled. 15:30 Does the military arena influence consumer electronics, or does the consumer electronics industry influence military technology? 16:00 GPS is a great example of military tech moving to consumer electronics 17:00 IoT (internet of things) is also driving a lot of the technology 18:00 The ISM band is unregulated! 19:15 A router uses a regulated frequency and hops off the frequency when it’s being used for emergency communications 20:50 RADAR, how does it work? 22:22 To learn more about RF, check out App Note 150 here: http://www.keysight.com/main/editorial.jspx?cc=US&lc=eng&ckey=459160&id=459160&cmpid=zzfindappnote150
- 23min - 19 - Wide Bandgap Semiconductors for Power Electronics – Electrical Engineering Podcast #20
Wide bandgap semiconductors, like Gallium Nitride (GaN) and Silicon Carbide (SiC) are shaping the future of power electronics by boosting power efficiency and reducing physical footprint. Server farms, alternative energy sources, and electrical grids will all be affected! Mike Hoffman and Daniel Bogdanoff sit down with Kenny Johnson to discuss in today's electrical engineering podcast. https://youtu.be/CGEDVYK8lTQ Links: Fact Sheet: https://energy.gov/eere/articles/infographic-wide-bandgap-semiconductors Fact Sheet https://energy.gov/sites/prod/files/2013/12/f5/wide_bandgap_semiconductors_factsheet.pdf Tech Assessment (Good timeline information) https://energy.gov/sites/prod/files/2015/02/f19/QTR%20Ch8%20-%20Wide%20Bandgap%20TA%20Feb-13-2015.pdf Agenda - Wide Bandgap Semiconductors Use in Power Electronics 3:00 What is a wide bandgap semiconductor? GaN (Gallium Nitride) devices and SiC (Silicon Carbide) can switch on and off much faster than typical silicon power devices. Wide bandgap semiconductors also have better thermal conductivity. And, wide bandgap semiconductors have a significantly lower drain-source resistance (R-on). For switch mode power supplies, the transistor switch time is the key source of inefficiency. So, switching faster makes things more efficient. 4:00 They will also reduce the size of power electronics. 6:30 Wide bandgap semiconductors have a very fast rise time, which can cause EMI and RFI problems. The high switching speed also means they can’t handle much parasitic inductance. So, today's IC packaging technology isn’t ideal. 8:30 Wide bandgap semiconductors are enabling the smart grid. The smart grid essentially means that you only turning on things being used, and turning off power completely when they aren’t being used. 9:35 Wide bandgap semiconductors will probably be integrated into server farms before they are used in power grid distribution or in homes. 10:20 Google uses a lot of power. 2.3 TWh (terawatt hour) NYT article: http://www.nytimes.com/2011/09/09/technology/google-details-and-defends-its-use-of-electricity.html It's estimated Google has 900,000 servers, and that accounts for maybe 1% of the world’s servers. So, they are willing to put in the investment to work out the details of this technology. 11:50 The US Department of Energy wants people to get an advanced degree in power electronics. Countries want to have technology leadership in this area. 13:00 Wide bandgap semiconductors are also very important for wind farms and other alternative forms of energy. Having a solid switch mode power supply means that you don’t have to have extra capacity. USA Dept of Energy: If industrial motor systems were wide bandgap semiconductors took over, it would save a ton of energy. 14:45 A huge percentage of the world’s power is consumed by electrical pumps. 16:20 Kenny’s oldest son works for a company that goes around and shows companies how to recover energy costs. There aren't many tools available for measuring wide bandgap semiconductor power electronics. 19:30 Utilities and servers are the two main industries that will initially adopt wide band gap semiconductors 20:35 When will this technology get implemented in the real world? There are parts available today, but it probably won’t be viable for roughly 2-5 years. 21:00 Devices with fast switching are beneficial, but have their own set of problems. The faster a devices switches, the more EMI and RFI you have to deal with. Spread spectrum clocking is a technique used to pass EMI compliance. 24:00 Band gaps of different materials: Diamond 5.5 eV Gallium Nitride (GaN) 3.4 eV Silicon Carbide (SiC) 3.3 eV
- 26min - 18 - Power Integrity and Signal Integrity – #19
How's the impedance of your ground plane? Do you look at your power rails in the frequency domain? Mike Hoffman and Daniel Bogdanoff sit down with power integrity expert Kenny Johnson to discuss the latest trends and techniques for measuring power supplies in today's electrical engineering podcast. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fg3miTJIA5M 00:15 Kenny gave us a tip during scope month 01:26 There are two types of power people. There are power producers, like the wind farms, power plants, and AC/DC adapter creators There are power consumers, who care very much about their power quality. The ripple on power supplies, etc. 3:03 Power integrity is the study of the effectiveness of the conversion and delivery of DC power from the source to the gates on the IC. 3:45 If Moore's Law holds out for another 600 years, we will have a computer that is capable of simulating every atom in the known universe. 4:35 Thermal hotspots were causing problems, so voltage levels started dropping 5:00 Kenny went to Amazon to look for a power integrity book. There were only 2-3 books a few years ago Power integrity has been a thing since the 1930s 5:50 Product functional reliability is directly proportional to the power quality in a product. We're supplying a voltage to devices, but also current. So, this starts to look a lot like Ohm's law. A device has both power and a ground plane. Power integrity pioneers include Istvan Novak and Ray Ridley and they talk about flat impedance power planes. 7:15 Flat impedance power planes - divide the supply power by the peak current, multiply it by your tolerance, you get a target impedance for your power planes. If you can maintain a frequency flat impedance, you don't see noise on your power supplies. 7:55 Think back to circuits 101, an inductor is open at a high frequency. And, a power plane is basically a big inductor. If you are, for example, writing high speed digital data to memory, it will be a problem. 8:40 When you look at boards, you see bypass capacitors to counteract the inductors 10:30 Experienced engineers use a lot of intuition when working out power distribution. Now, there's a lot of localized power distribution. 11:15 A typical SSD has 12 power supplies A tablet can have 50 power supplies Some of our oscilloscopes have 180 power supply rails Next generation mobile electronics 100-200 power supplies 12:25 There are redundant power supplies spread out across the device to help improve reliability. For example, there may be multiple converters that all power the same rail to help spread the loads. The reason intuition is used is that a lot of people don't have access to good simulation tools. They just have to use some rules of thumb and over-engineer the device to try to get reliability. 15:10 Kenny has a lot of patents. Our CTO Jay Alexander used to hold the record for most patents at the Colorado Springs site. Kenny has nearly 30 patents. 17:15 Kenny started as a probe designer, then got into power integrity. Kenny recommends one by Bogatin about signal integrity, and a second edition called Signal Integrity and Power Integrity 18:35 SIPI labs - signal integrity and power integrity lab. Power integrity will affect your signal integrity, your EMI (electromagnetic interference) and your EMC (electromagnetic compatibility). (measure power integrity with a power rail probe) So, the progressive companies have these SIPI labs. There are more advanced tools available. 20:10 Multiple papers say that power supply induced jitter is the single biggest source of data jitter in a digital system. Kenny has some IOT development kits, and it's easy to make them drop bits. Dropping bits will have an effect on battery life, performance, etc. 21:08 How to clean up a power supply? The majority of the time, it's easiest to use a bypass capacitor. After you've looked at your supply in the time domain, look at it in the frequency domain. That will help you debug where the noise is c
- 29min
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